camry or subaru?

[amanda992004]

What engine in the Camry? The 2.4l 4 cyl. engine or the V6?

Is 2.4L I-4 160 HP in Camries called 4 cyl. engine? I heard bad news
about V6; so no V6 for me.

What engine for the Legacy? Turbo or no turbo?

2.5L H-4 250 HP (this is turbo, right?) versus 2.5L H-4 168 HP (no
turbo?). I prefer the former.

With the 4cyl. engine, go with the Legacy, otherwise pick the Camry

Is that because UNLESS I get turbo in Subaru legacy (i.e 2.5 GT),
it's not even worth bothering getting a Subaru legacy?

unless you drive in the snow 6 months a year..

No snow here. I will have a garage to keep my car.

The reason I am resuming my interest in Subaru over Camry is that I
really love my friend's Subaru 2.5 GT. I don't know much about cars
in detail but I know that I really like the control he has with his 2.5
GT. I feel so comfortable sitting in front passenger seat; do not feel
motion during turns like poeplw ould feel when I turn (in my front
wheel drive Nissan Sentra or previously owned Honda Civic.

I hardly will have people sitting in the back seat and so I am not too
concern about the space in the back area that some people point out in
Subaru. I would pull the driver seat so close to the steering wheel
that the back should have enough room left.

Is it going to be REAL headache w.r.t maintenance to own a Subaru 2.5GT
in this city of (Sacramento) ?

 

[Tom Reingold]

Is 2.4L I-4 160 HP in Camries called 4 cyl. engine? I heard bad news
about V6; so no V6 for me.




2.5L H-4 250 HP (this is turbo, right?) versus 2.5L H-4 168 HP (no
turbo?). I prefer the former.




Is that because UNLESS I get turbo in Subaru legacy (i.e 2.5 GT),
it's not even worth bothering getting a Subaru legacy?

It's a matter of taste. 165 hp is plenty for me. You can answer your
question by test driving both.

I don't understand people who find 165 inadequate, but again, it's a
matter of taste.

Tom

 

[amanda992004]

I think 165 would be enough for me too. Only that that they don't come
with the Heated Front Seats which I want for winter.

 

[Earle Jones]

I like the Prius - a LOT! My in-laws have one, so I have plenty of
first hand experience with the car.

However, you've got to remove the blinders regarding fuel mileage!

The Prius is currently selling way over sticker in many areas, and
this is for a car that may not even arrive for 6-8 months. There are
still some issues regarding battery replacement costs down the road.

***
Two points: Wait list and price: The waiting period is growing
every day shorter -- many cars are now on the lots. I would never
pay more than MSRP -- if some dealer wants to charge you a premium
-- go to another dealer.

Battery replacement and cost:

The battery (in fact, the whole electrical drive train including
batteries, motors, generators, etc.) is guaranteed (in California
and other states that use the CA emission standards) for ten years
or 150,000 miles. This is much better than the guarantee on the
internal combustion engine! The electric system should be the last
of your problems.
***

A 4 cylinder Camry can be had for less, gets mid 30's fuel mileage,
and has a higher payload and more room.

***
And a Camry hybrid will be available sometime in '06. Toyota has
announced that a new Hybrid Camry factory will be opened in Kentucky
sometime next year.
***

A Subaru is all-wheel drive. While the Prius is OK in snow, it ain't
no Subaru in the winter. The Subaru will also carry far more cargo
than the Prius, as well as tow ~2000 pounds.

***
My second car is a 2001 Subaru Outback wagon. Yes, it has all wheel
drive and will probably do better in snow (which I don't see very
often). When my Subaru odometer gets to 300 miles I begin looking
for a gas station. It costs about $40 to fill the 16-gallon tank.

When my Prius gets to about 400 miles, I start to worry. The
blinking fuel light bars begin at about 480 miles. At that time, it
usually needs about 8 gallons for about $20.

I have no complaints about the Prius -- it is just about perfect for
my wife and I. Plenty of room for two weeks of luggage. We just
finished a 2,000 mile trip from the San Francisco Bay area to the
Grand Canyon, including ventures into Sequoia National Park at 7,000
feet and crossing high Sierra passes at about 8,000 feet. For the
trip, the average MPG was a bit over 50.

There is no reason not to get on the Prius bandwagon.

Recently there have been some news reports that the Prius has had
unexpected stalls at Freeway speeds. The NHTSA reported that 30
Prius cars had reported this.

Another poster, who works for the Los Angeles Traffic department
reported that there are a total of about 200 stalls on Los Angeles
freeways ***every day***.

These don't tend to make the news.

earle
*

 

[Earle Jones]

Why do people report the mileage they get when they take a long trip?
That's the absolute best case scenario.

Tom

*
Nope. Not in the Prius. The MPG will be much better in city
traffic, where the electric system is running near optimum. It is
out on the freeways that the internal combustion engine has to
deliver its power and the MPG suffers.

The EPA numbers for the '05 Prius are 60 city and 51 highway. In
the real world, I would not expect to get these performances
however. The EPA tests are done on special rigs with no air
conditioning, radio, heat, etc. Also no wind resistance, since they
are done on stationary dynamometer installations.

The best estimate is that the actual fuel consumption would be about
10% less than the EPA ratings. In other words, instead of 60/51 for
Prius, it would be about 54/45. This is just about exactly my
experience with my '05.

earle
*

 

[Rick Courtright]

unexpected stalls at Freeway speeds. The NHTSA reported that 30
Prius cars had reported this.

Another poster, who works for the Los Angeles Traffic department
reported that there are a total of about 200 stalls on Los Angeles
freeways ***every day***.

These don't tend to make the news.

Hi,

I don't find it surprising the everyday stalls aren't reported. The
Prius is brand new (relatively) and there aren't a lot of them out
there, so ANYTHING odd is gonna hit the radar screen long before the 200
people out of some 10 million living and driving the LA area everyday
who experience stalls might. Especially since if one were to look more
closely one might find a majority of those stalls are either "run out of
gas" or "less than stellar maintenance" situations.

Any new product's gonna be under the microscope until it proves itself,
especially when it's using technologies not commonly seen (at least not
yet?)

Rick

 

[Tom Reingold]

Why do people report the mileage they get when they take a long trip?
That's the absolute best case scenario.

Tom

*
Nope. Not in the Prius. The MPG will be much better in city
traffic, where the electric system is running near optimum. It is
out on the freeways that the internal combustion engine has to
deliver its power and the MPG suffers.

The EPA numbers for the '05 Prius are 60 city and 51 highway. [...]

Here is my amended question.

Why do people who own non-Priuses report the mileage they get when they
take a long trip? If they are not driving a Prius, long trips are a best
case scenario and not representative of the car's true efficiency.

Tom

 

[Jim Stewart]

Why do people report the mileage they get when they take a long trip?
That's the absolute best case scenario.

Tom

*
Nope. Not in the Prius. The MPG will be much better in city traffic,
where the electric system is running near optimum. It is out on the
freeways that the internal combustion engine has to deliver its power
and the MPG suffers.

The EPA numbers for the '05 Prius are 60 city and 51 highway. [...]

Here is my amended question.

Why do people who own non-Priuses report the mileage they get when they
take a long trip? If they are not driving a Prius, long trips are a best
case scenario and not representative of the car's true efficiency.

Because it's easy and it's comparable with others' mileage.

Someone that drives in hilly San Francisco can't
compare mileage to someone in Kansas. Likewise
stop-and-go can't be compared to freeway commute
miles.

OTOH, trip mileage tends to be more comparable
amongst geographical strangers.