3rd Light Benefits?

[CompUser]

The idea of a lighted sign in the back of a car with varying messages is
appealing. It's been shot down many times on http://www.halfbakery.com
but I don't remember why. I think I'd like to have one. I might load it
up with about a dozen ready-made messages.

JC Whitney's carried them for several years.

 

[JoeZZLevy]

In the early 1980's (in the U.S.) somebody sponsored fleet tests of these
lights.

(I think it was an insurance company working with taxicab fleets, but don't
quote me...)

The huge reduction in rear-end collisions seen in these studies was what led
to the "3rd eye" requirement for passenger cars.

Joe

 

[Hallraker]

You kids nowdays... You always go for the obvious.

Look here to see how we did it in the old days:
http://www.cia.gov/cia/information/artifacts/caltrop.htm

I wonder if an extremely powerful electromagnet mounted to the front bumper
would be enough to clear those from the roadway, even at high speed?

-Matt

 

[tom klein]

Look here:
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/rules/regrev/evaluate/808696.html

yeah, but...

the nhtsa may *think* they were mandatory on the '86 model year, but my
'86 honda accord (a lovely car, by the way) definitely DID NOT come
with a third brake light (i added one myself).

otherwise, i would agree with their conclusions - it's a cheap and
effective safety measure.

now, if i could only aim the heat-seekers low enough to take out that
suv in front of me, i'd be able to *see* the damned brake lights again!

 

[John Varela]

I'm starting to love wikipedia!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_brake_light

So it's been 19 years. So I lied.

I bought a 1985 1/2 Honda Prelude 2.0 Si (the first fuel-injected Honda) in
August of 1976. It did not have the third light. The 1986 model did.
You're only off by a couple of months.

 

[John Varela]

my
'86 honda accord (a lovely car, by the way) definitely DID NOT come
with a third brake light (i added one myself).

Are you *sure* it was an '86? I am equally sure that the '86 Prelude 2.0 Si
had the third light, because my '85 1/2 was one of the rare ones that did
not.

 

[JaySee]

I wonder if anyone is doing studies on these new cars with 3rd brake
lights that either go brighter the harder you break or have widening
LEDs like the LED strip on K.I.T., but as a 3rd brake light. Starts
with a small line in the center, then goes wider lighting more LEDs on
the strip to signify harder braking.

 

[Moon Guy]

What would I do with a front brake light? It's not my job to avoid being
rear-ended. That's the job of the person following me.

You can certainly do something to avoid being rear ended.
If someone is following too close, simply leave enough space in front of
you for him too. I suggest twice the distance.

If you have to stop quickly, hit the brakes hard for a second to wake
the follower up, then let off and brake more easily.

 

[Looser Inc.]

and what you do with the guy behind the second?...
third light is use not only to advice teh second... even the third...

 

[Tom Reingold]

You can certainly do something to avoid being rear ended.
If someone is following too close, simply leave enough space in front of
you for him too. I suggest twice the distance.

If you have to stop quickly, hit the brakes hard for a second to wake
the follower up, then let off and brake more easily.

You mean pull ahead? That might work for a few seconds. Then he might
pull up and tailgate me again. Some people are aggressive. Some people
just aren't thinking and are unduly comfortable with following closely.
I can't control how closely they follow.

I do have tailgating avoidance techniques. If I'm on a highway and
someone tailgates me and I'm not in the right lane, I pull into the
right lane. Fair enough, because if I can, I should.

If I'm on a highway and in the right lane and someone tailgates, I might
speed up and slow down alternately a few times. This can wake the guy up
and lead him to decide to pull out and around me.

I sometimes even stick my arm out and wave back and forth with my palm
facing backwards, to say "back off". I had to do this yesterday to an
18-wheeler! He pulled around me.

On local roads, if someone tailgates me, I sometimes pull off to let
them pass. Better to be safe and calm than to start a fight, right?

But if I can't or won't for some reason, I sometimes drive erratically,
to make the guy think I'm nuts and stay away from me. If you do this, be
careful.

I wish there were such a thing as a tailgating gun, analogous to a speed
radar. I think cops would do a better job if they enforced tailgating
rules more and speed laws less.

Tom

 

[Cam Penner]

You mean pull ahead? That might work for a few seconds. Then he might
pull up and tailgate me again. Some people are aggressive. Some people
just aren't thinking and are unduly comfortable with following closely.
I can't control how closely they follow.

No, I think he's talking about leaving extra distance in
case traffic ahead stops in a hurry. You basically allow
for the stopping distance you need plus the stopping
distance HE needs. Then you just don't brake as hard
(because you don't need to) allowing him to complete his
braking without using your bumper.

I do have tailgating avoidance techniques. If I'm on a highway and
someone tailgates me and I'm not in the right lane, I pull into the
right lane. Fair enough, because if I can, I should.

Good plan.

If I'm on a highway and in the right lane and someone tailgates, I might
speed up and slow down alternately a few times. This can wake the guy up
and lead him to decide to pull out and around me.

I find a couple of flashes of the brake lights generally
will work too. If it doesn't, they're doing it
intentionally. Don't keep trying, they'll just creep
closer.

On local roads, if someone tailgates me, I sometimes pull off to let
them pass. Better to be safe and calm than to start a fight, right?

I'd ALWAYS rather have a tailgater in front of me than
behind me. Not a bad plan at all.

But if I can't or won't for some reason, I sometimes drive erratically,
to make the guy think I'm nuts and stay away from me. If you do this, be
careful.

Just don't drive aggressively erratically. Slowly drift to
the edge of your lane, and then jerk back as if you're
dozing off.

I wish there were such a thing as a tailgating gun, analogous to a speed
radar. I think cops would do a better job if they enforced tailgating
rules more and speed laws less.

I've seen tickets where cops measure the distance between
cars with the laser gun and write up following too close
tickets. Not nearly often enough, but it can and is done.

An option you didn't mention - if you have enough HP at
your disposal is to pass the car ahead of you. Make the
tailgater his problem, not yours. I do this on my
motorcycle.

 

[Tom Reingold]

An option you didn't mention - if you have enough HP at
your disposal is to pass the car ahead of you. Make the
tailgater his problem, not yours. I do this on my
motorcycle.

Not in my 165 HP Legacy wagon! :-D

Tom

 

[Al]

and what you do with the guy behind the second?...
third light is use not only to advice teh second... even the third...

Many, many years ago, I spoofed the tailgater following me. I jammed on
my brakes for an instant, just long enough to turn the brake lights on.
And, the guy who was tailgating him, ran into him. Ah, sweet revenge.

Al

 

[Hank]

Moon Guy wrote:

I wish there were such a thing as a tailgating gun

We have one, by accident -- a tailgating squirtgun.

One of the four windshield sprayer ports on the hood of my wife's Honda
for some reason squirts up over the top of the car, producing a
spattering of rain on the tailgating vehicle.

Since there are two per side on the front windshield, it's never been a
problem.

When I'm being tailgated while driving her car, I, um, always start to
worry about visibility as well as stopping distances.

So, I lean on the front windshield washer button for a while -- and
simultaneously turn on the REAR windshield wiper and washer.

Between the wig-wag on the rear window, and the spattering on the
windshield of of the sleeping driver behind me, it works, consistently,
and seems not to annoy the tailgaters because they don't know I'm doing
it to wash _them_.

I do all the other maneuvers too -- pull to the right lane, signaling
first; tap my brakes; slow down while tapping my brakes; leave the road
in a safe spot if necessary.

I learned from a CHP officer that they're always told never to pull off
the road at night and stop _behind_ a disabled or stopped vehicle (as
opposed to a traffic stop, where they use the red light to pull someone
over and want to be behind them lighting them up and with flashers on
--- this is because drunks will often lock onto taillights ahead, and
at night, they not uncommonly drive into vehicles that are on the
shoulder with just the taillights lit up.

I think that's also true for tailgaters -- they're often somewhat
incompetent at staying on the road and are using whatever's in front of
them as an easy guide to where the edges of the lanes are.

 

[CompUser]

I've seen tickets where cops measure the distance between
cars with the laser gun and write up following too close
tickets. Not nearly often enough, but it can and is done.

That I'd like to see...how lidar would work,
measuring distance between to objects moving,
relative to the lidar unit.

"Following to closely" is generally only written
when there's been an accident (ie the follower
slammed into the followee), otherwise, it's based
on the officer's *opinion*, which is rebuttable
("Why do you say he was following to closely
officer? Was there an accident? Did my client
strike the other vehicle? Did anything happen at
all, officer?").

 

[Al]

I've seen tickets where cops measure the distance between
cars with the laser gun and write up following too close
tickets. Not nearly often enough, but it can and is done.

That I'd like to see...how lidar would work,
measuring distance between to objects moving,
relative to the lidar unit.

"Following to closely" is generally only written
when there's been an accident (ie the follower
slammed into the followee), otherwise, it's based
on the officer's *opinion*, which is rebuttable
("Why do you say he was following to closely
officer? Was there an accident? Did my client
strike the other vehicle? Did anything happen at
all, officer?").[/QUOTE]

Rule here is one car length for every 10MPH. The tailgaters I'm talking
about are the ones whose pimples you can see in the rear view mirror.

Al

 

[k. ote]

Many, many years ago, I spoofed the tailgater following me. I jammed on
my brakes for an instant, just long enough to turn the brake lights on.
And, the guy who was tailgating him, ran into him. Ah, sweet revenge.

So in other words, you're happy you caused a potentially life-threatening
accident that might otherwise not have happened?

What a jerk.

 

[tom klein]

that "rule", although it's probably in every driver handbook, doesn't
work too well: first of all, how long is a "car length"? is it 10',
16', or 20'? and second, measuring distance is not something most
people can do accurately, while traveling at 100 km/hr. ("five car
lengths" doesn't look all that different from "six and a half car
lengths" to the average driver.)

a MUCH better way to judge following distance is based on reaction
TIME: if you allow 2 seconds (minimum) between yourself and the car in
front of you, that will allow safe following at ANY speed. (it
automatically adjusts for speed.) most people can react in less than
two seconds, which is where the safety part comes in...

it is also easier to check, by counting 2 seconds from the time the car
in front of you passes a post or road marking, until you reach the same
point. and you can do it without taking your eyes off the road.


........ tom klein

That I'd like to see...how lidar would work, measuring distance between
to objects moving, relative to the lidar unit.

"Following to closely" is generally only written when there's been an
accident (ie the follower slammed into the followee), otherwise, it's
based on the officer's *opinion*, which is rebuttable
("Why do you say he was following to closely officer? Was there an
accident? Did my client strike the other vehicle? Did anything happen
at all, officer?").

Rule here is one car length for every 10MPH. The tailgaters I'm talking
about are the ones whose pimples you can see in the rear view mirror.

Al[/QUOTE]

 

[tom klein]

it was definitely an '86 accord "s" (hatchback), bought relatively late
in the model year - may, 1986, but it might also be because it was a
canadian model, and there may have been differences in the regulations
that year.


........ tom klein

 

[Timo]

Just wanted to jump in to say (on behalf of my 17-year-old son) that I've
been tailgated by plenty of middle-aged men and women in my 35 years of
driving, not just teenagers. I've found that using the emergency flashers
works best to get the idiot off my tail.

You know how you can smell the sulphur from a lit match in the car ahead of
you? I wish someone would invent a dispenser that could release some eau de
skunk out a special vent beside the license plate. Flashers combined with
some terrible odor would have a gradual pavlovian effect, don't you think?
Timo