Squeak in wheel that goes away

[Yousuf Khan]

I hear a very high-pitched squeak coming from the driver's side front
wheel at low speeds when just starting out in the morning. It goes away
after a few seconds, and doesn't come back until after it's rested a
while again. I think it may be a leaking CV joint perhaps, that gets
lubricated with movement, what do you think?

Yousuf Khan

 

[VanguardLH]

I hear a very high-pitched squeak coming from the driver's side front
wheel at low speeds when just starting out in the morning. It goes away
after a few seconds, and doesn't come back until after it's rested a
while again. I think it may be a leaking CV joint perhaps, that gets
lubricated with movement, what do you think?

Might be the brake pads are rubbing against the disc. Actually the pads
always rub and then get pushed away from the disc but maybe they're not
being allowed to properly "float" over the disc. Could be the rubber
for the piston seal is getting old and doesn't flex well. Could be
there is some rust on the slider rod that makes the caliber stick.

I can only speak for the very few times that I've had a bad CV joint but
it didn't squeal or squeak but instead I heard a grinding noise also
sometimes called a humming or growling noise. Cheap rebuilt or worn CV
joints can also rattle: you'll hear clunking or vibration noise when you
accelerate or decelerate. You might hear a popping or clicking noise
when turning (but you never mentioned the noise was heard only during
turning). I don't recall a squeaking noise that abates after getting
warmed up being attributed to CV joints and why I suspect you have a
brake problem, or maybe even a bad drive belt that needs replacing.

 

[Nobody > (Revisited)]

Might be the brake pads are rubbing against the disc. Actually the pads
always rub and then get pushed away from the disc but maybe they're not
being allowed to properly "float" over the disc. Could be the rubber
for the piston seal is getting old and doesn't flex well. Could be
there is some rust on the slider rod that makes the caliber stick.

I can only speak for the very few times that I've had a bad CV joint but
it didn't squeal or squeak but instead I heard a grinding noise also
sometimes called a humming or growling noise. Cheap rebuilt or worn CV
joints can also rattle: you'll hear clunking or vibration noise when you
accelerate or decelerate. You might hear a popping or clicking noise
when turning (but you never mentioned the noise was heard only during
turning). I don't recall a squeaking noise that abates after getting
warmed up being attributed to CV joints and why I suspect you have a
brake problem, or maybe even a bad drive belt that needs replacing.

My guess also is brake pad(s).

For some idiot reason, Thunderbird's been hosing off read posts to
never-never-land, so I can't see the OP.

This is fairly common in hi-humidity areas, the rotors actually get a
fine rustcoat in hours. You might not ever be able to see it (and
there's no real damage in normal use), but some combo's of pads and
rotors just "do it"

Does the squeal go away (far)faster if you lightly ride the brake for a
minute or so? If so, this is the probable cause.


--
"Shit this is it, all the pieces do fit.
We're like that crazy old man jumping
out of the alleyway with a baseball bat,
saying, "Remember me motherfucker?"
Jim “Dandy” Mangrum

 

[Yousuf Khan]

Might be the brake pads are rubbing against the disc. Actually the pads
always rub and then get pushed away from the disc but maybe they're not
being allowed to properly "float" over the disc. Could be the rubber
for the piston seal is getting old and doesn't flex well. Could be
there is some rust on the slider rod that makes the caliber stick.

Okay, so a leaking CV joint would result in a lower-pitched noise than
what I'm hearing?

I can only speak for the very few times that I've had a bad CV joint but
it didn't squeal or squeak but instead I heard a grinding noise also
sometimes called a humming or growling noise. Cheap rebuilt or worn CV
joints can also rattle: you'll hear clunking or vibration noise when you
accelerate or decelerate. You might hear a popping or clicking noise
when turning (but you never mentioned the noise was heard only during
turning). I don't recall a squeaking noise that abates after getting
warmed up being attributed to CV joints and why I suspect you have a
brake problem, or maybe even a bad drive belt that needs replacing.

It's definitely coming from the wheels and not the engine. The noise
doesn't occur until the car starts moving.

As for does the noise happen while I'm turning? Yes. Most of my
manoeuvring from my driveway involves a turning action at some point.
But I think I've heard it squeaking even if I'm just backing out
straight sometimes. But it's mostly prevalent during the times I'm turning.

If this is a rusting brake caliper, what can I do to lubricate it?
WD-40? Silicon or Lithium Grease? Etc.?

Yousuf Khan

 

[Yousuf Khan]

This is fairly common in hi-humidity areas, the rotors actually get a
fine rustcoat in hours. You might not ever be able to see it (and
there's no real damage in normal use), but some combo's of pads and
rotors just "do it"

Does the squeal go away (far)faster if you lightly ride the brake for a
minute or so? If so, this is the probable cause.

No, the squeal goes away on its own, after a few revolutions of the
wheels at normal travelling speeds, no need to ride the brakes or
anything. The squeal usually happens sometimes when I'm reversing or
sometimes when I'm going forward, but usually while I'm turning at the
same time. As I said just the first turn of the day, no other turns
cause this afterwards. But the squeal is very loud in my opinion.

Yousuf Khan

 

[VanguardLH]

No, the squeal goes away on its own, after a few revolutions of the
wheels at normal travelling speeds, no need to ride the brakes or
anything. The squeal usually happens sometimes when I'm reversing or
sometimes when I'm going forward, but usually while I'm turning at the
same time. As I said just the first turn of the day, no other turns
cause this afterwards. But the squeal is very loud in my opinion.

Pads float over disc. This means they are hitting the disc, bounce
away, come back, and repeat. Unlike heads in a hard disk that actually
fly due to aerodynamics, pads don't fly. There is an oscillation with
pads as they effectively "float". If something is causing the pads to
press harder against the disc then something is sticky, like a dried out
seal around the piston, a sticky piston, rust on the slider rod for the
caliper, etc. When the pads get heated up and that passes the rest of
the caliper, play will increase so the squeal goes away.

As I mentioned, I haven't heard squeaking attributed as a noise for worn
or damaged CV joints. Since you now mention that the squeal is heard
during turns, my other guess of a worn drive belt is another cause of
the noise. Some belts don't have visible artifacts to let you know when
they're worn and stretched. Usually the cost is cheap enough that you
can simply replace the belt yourself. While there are belt tensioner
devices to let you know at what point to stop rotating the adjustment
screw (usually on the alternator), I just adjust until there is 1/4"
play in the belt, run it a week, and check again.

Clunking, popping, rattling, humming or vibration, growling, or groaning
are the sounds usually attributed to CV problems, not squeaks.

 

[VanguardLH]

Okay, so a leaking CV joint would result in a lower-pitched noise than
what I'm hearing?


It's definitely coming from the wheels and not the engine. The noise
doesn't occur until the car starts moving.

Which means there is more torque on the drive belt when the power
steering pump gets used. You later mentioned in another post that the
sound is heard more during turns. As the car warms up, so does the belt
along with no longer being positioned at its stretch marks around the
pulleys. My guess is a warmed up drive belt has more grip than a cold
one. Also, due to heat expansion of the engine and change in
positioning of the components around which the belt moves, the belt will
tighten up as the car warms up (but might take 5 to 20 miles before it
tightens up based on how long you idle, RPM, outside temperature, city
versus highway driving, etc). My mother's car need a new drive belt and
it squeals, even more so during turns, until a few miles have been
driven.

So how old is the fan belt? What are the extremes in outdoor
temperatures during that time (i.e., summer versus winter)? Any
contaminants get on it (engine oil, coolant, been splashing through
puddles, etc)?

The fan belt replacement you can do yourself and its a cheap repair and
may even be needed if the belt is old. Don't rely looking at the belt
anymore looking for cracks or chips in the ribbing as some compounds
won't show that despite the belt is worn and stretched. You could check
the deflection of the old belt and see if tightening it up eliminates
the squeak but I'd suggest going with a new belt in the first place.

If this is a rusting brake caliper, what can I do to lubricate it?
WD-40? Silicon or Lithium Grease? Etc.?

You would need to replace the dried out seal around the piston is that's
the cause. That means a caliper overhaul which you probably don't have
the equipment, parts, and expertise. The fact that you think WD40 or
other lube is going to get rid of a brake squeal pretty much indicates
you don't know how brakes work and you don't know how to repair them.
Some shops will burnish the slider rod if it has rust on it (mine get
rust rings because it sits for months unused). The pads don't move
(except with the caliper which is sliding on the rod. I'd suggest
taking it in for a brake inspection if you think it's a brake problem.
Then you can find out which shops are willing to do some minor repairs
yourself and which ones just want to slap in a whole new caliper and
charge you lots of money.

There is another cause of a squeal (although I've usually heard it as a
groan): a pebble stuck between the disc and dust shield. This can
actually burrow a groove into the disc which can exceed the depth a shop
is allowed to turn a disc. In the past, you could probably turn (lathe
down) a disc 2 or 3 times. Once is about all you get nowadays and
probably won't fix a groove caused by stuck gravel wearing against the
disc - but then just removing the gravel eliminates the noise (but not
the groove that lets water get in between the disc and pad).

 

[1 Lucky Texan]

I hear a very high-pitched squeak coming from the driver's side front
wheel at low speeds when just starting out in the morning. It goes away
after a few seconds, and doesn't come back until after it's rested a
while again. I think it may be a leaking CV joint perhaps, that gets
lubricated with movement, what do you think?

        Yousuf Khan

I've had a strut mount that would squeak when turning. Do you ever
hear the sound after starting the engine and working the wheel back
and forth WITHOUT moving forward? If so, could be abelt as mentioned
or a strut mount.

 

[Yousuf Khan]

I've had a strut mount that would squeak when turning. Do you ever
hear the sound after starting the engine and working the wheel back
and forth WITHOUT moving forward? If so, could be abelt as mentioned
or a strut mount.

Actually, I have tried that, and no, I don't hear the noise during that
time, so it can't be the engine belt. The belt was actually replaced not
too long ago, as the dealer had noticed it was fraying. It must've been
within a year ago.

Yousuf Khan

 

[Yousuf Khan]

Which means there is more torque on the drive belt when the power
steering pump gets used. You later mentioned in another post that the
sound is heard more during turns. As the car warms up, so does the belt
along with no longer being positioned at its stretch marks around the
pulleys. My guess is a warmed up drive belt has more grip than a cold
one. Also, due to heat expansion of the engine and change in
positioning of the components around which the belt moves, the belt will
tighten up as the car warms up (but might take 5 to 20 miles before it
tightens up based on how long you idle, RPM, outside temperature, city
versus highway driving, etc). My mother's car need a new drive belt and
it squeals, even more so during turns, until a few miles have been
driven.

See my reply to Lucky Texan, he asked if the noise occurs even if I'm
not moving and just turning the wheels while sitting in place, and the
answer is no. As a matter of fact, the belts were replaced around a year
ago, when the dealer noticed that they were fraying, and I was having
some unrelated problems with my power steering at that time.

It doesn't take 5 to 20 miles for the noise to go away, it takes maybe a
less than 50 yards.

You would need to replace the dried out seal around the piston is that's
the cause. That means a caliper overhaul which you probably don't have
the equipment, parts, and expertise. The fact that you think WD40 or
other lube is going to get rid of a brake squeal pretty much indicates
you don't know how brakes work and you don't know how to repair them.
Some shops will burnish the slider rod if it has rust on it (mine get
rust rings because it sits for months unused). The pads don't move
(except with the caliper which is sliding on the rod. I'd suggest
taking it in for a brake inspection if you think it's a brake problem.
Then you can find out which shops are willing to do some minor repairs
yourself and which ones just want to slap in a whole new caliper and
charge you lots of money.

Obviously I wasn't talking about putting it on the brake pads or the
disk rotors, just on the mount points of the calipers where the front
and back join each other and they may slide against each other.

There is another cause of a squeal (although I've usually heard it as a
groan): a pebble stuck between the disc and dust shield. This can
actually burrow a groove into the disc which can exceed the depth a shop
is allowed to turn a disc. In the past, you could probably turn (lathe
down) a disc 2 or 3 times. Once is about all you get nowadays and
probably won't fix a groove caused by stuck gravel wearing against the
disc - but then just removing the gravel eliminates the noise (but not
the groove that lets water get in between the disc and pad).

I don't think it's got anything to do with the braking surfaces
themselves, besides, if a pebble were stuck between the pad and rotor it
would be a constant squeal, not one that goes away in a couple of yards.
However, rusting braking calipers might not be a bad place to look for
this noise.

Yousuf Khan

 

[Rockinghorse Winner]

I hear a very high-pitched squeak coming from the driver's side front
wheel at low speeds when just starting out in the morning. It goes away
after a few seconds, and doesn't come back until after it's rested a
while again. I think it may be a leaking CV joint perhaps, that gets
lubricated with movement, what do you think?

Yousuf Khan

CV joint, or wheel bearing. Don't let it go too long, unless you like to
live dangerously. :\

*R* *H*

 

[clare]

CV joint, or wheel bearing. Don't let it go too long, unless you like to
live dangerously. :\

*R* *H*

Is it a pretty steady squeal, or a chirp? If it's a high pitche
squeal it COULD be brakes, and it COULD just be an agrivation, as
compared to a problem.

 

[1 Lucky Texan]

See my reply to Lucky Texan, he asked if the noise occurs even if I'm
not moving and just turning the wheels while sitting in place, and the
answer is no. As a matter of fact, the belts were replaced around a year
ago, when the dealer noticed that they were fraying, and I was having
some unrelated problems with my power steering at that time.

It doesn't take 5 to 20 miles for the noise to go away, it takes maybe a
less than 50 yards.



Obviously I wasn't talking about putting it on the brake pads or the
disk rotors, just on the mount points of the calipers where the front
and back join each other and they may slide against each other.


I don't think it's got anything to do with the braking surfaces
themselves, besides, if a pebble were stuck between the pad and rotor it
would be a constant squeal, not one that goes away in a couple of yards.
However, rusting braking calipers might not be a bad place to look for
this noise.

        Yousuf Khan

Perhaps double check the lug nuts. I read once of a guy whose wheel
was loose! His theory was that maybe a theft of his rims was
interrupted or he had an 'enemy' try to cause a wreck.

 

[clare]

There is something called brake grease, or caliper grease, or
SilGlyde, that you put on the brake sliders and all metal to metal
contact points of the caliper assembly that pretty well looks after
the most common causes. You do need to make sure the caliper piston
itself is not seized and the rubbers are OK - but the calipers,
particularly on most Japanese cars - but it's a good idea on Yank cars
as well, should be serviced every 6 months to a year.

Always used to do it every second oil change in years gone by.
Which really isn't an issue.

 

[Yousuf Khan]

Perhaps double check the lug nuts. I read once of a guy whose wheel
was loose! His theory was that maybe a theft of his rims was
interrupted or he had an 'enemy' try to cause a wreck.

It seems to have magically gone away since about a couple of weeks ago,
on its own. I have a feeling that those who suggested maybe it was the
brake calipers might have been right. Perhaps the stiction worked itself
loose after some usage?

Yousuf Khan

 

[Yousuf Khan]

There is something called brake grease, or caliper grease, or
SilGlyde, that you put on the brake sliders and all metal to metal
contact points of the caliper assembly that pretty well looks after
the most common causes. You do need to make sure the caliper piston
itself is not seized and the rubbers are OK - but the calipers,
particularly on most Japanese cars - but it's a good idea on Yank cars
as well, should be serviced every 6 months to a year.

Really? How does it differ from regular silicon grease? Is it just a
different formulation, or is the can designed to work without spilling
anything onto the rotors or something like that?

Yousuf Khan

 

[clare]

Really? How does it differ from regular silicon grease? Is it just a
different formulation, or is the can designed to work without spilling
anything onto the rotors or something like that?

Yousuf Khan

It is a special high temperature and water resistant grease made
specifically for brakes - and you need to be carefull NOT to get it
onto rotors and friction material.

 

[1 Lucky Texan]

Really? How does it differ from regular silicon grease? Is it just a
different formulation, or is the can designed to work without spilling
anything onto the rotors or something like that?

        Yousuf Khan

I bought some of the following - probably several lifetime's supply.
It came highly recommended and seems to work fine for me;

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0018PSASU

 

[clare]

I bought some of the following - probably several lifetime's supply.
It came highly recommended and seems to work fine for me;

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0018PSASU

Excellent stuff - you can't get much better for the application.