Question about wheels and offsets

[Hachiroku $B%O%A%m%/(B]

Back to another Subaru I have. The wheels rub against the calipers in the
front. Hey, they fit, they're the right diameter, what gives?!

They're also rusty, so I am trying to replace them. In the course of
looking for used wheels for an '89 Suby GL hacthback (NOT the Brat-looking
hatch, the Loyale looking hatch) I have run across 5 sets of wheels! The
Brat-looking hatch has one that it shares with the Brat looking wagon, the
Loyale has another, the Legacy has another, and the GL hatch has another.

I think what happened was that someone didn't know the difference and put
a set of 2WD offset wheels (Yeah, it appears to make a difference) on an
AWD GL Hatch. These wheels are HARD to find; it looks like I can put Brat
8-spokes on it according to the Subaru parts book for 1989.

Aside from this, and finding the proper wheels, is there another way to
get the proper offset? I was thinking of wheel spacers; I only need 2-5mm
space (I think the difference is 48mm for the 2WD wheel and 50mm for the
AWD wheel). It has that wonky 4x140 bolt pattern.

Is there a safe way to 'shim' the wheels to get a few more mm of offset?

 

[johninKY]

I think what you have is an early set of Subaru wheels. Recall reading
about how the very early wheels (pre 1985) would not fit the later years
for the reason you described. Any wheel from 85 to 94 should fit
perfectly. Forget about shimming the wheels.

 

[Carl 1 Lucky Texan]

Back to another Subaru I have. The wheels rub against the calipers in the
front. Hey, they fit, they're the right diameter, what gives?!

They're also rusty, so I am trying to replace them. In the course of
looking for used wheels for an '89 Suby GL hacthback (NOT the Brat-looking
hatch, the Loyale looking hatch) I have run across 5 sets of wheels! The
Brat-looking hatch has one that it shares with the Brat looking wagon, the
Loyale has another, the Legacy has another, and the GL hatch has another.

I think what happened was that someone didn't know the difference and put
a set of 2WD offset wheels (Yeah, it appears to make a difference) on an
AWD GL Hatch. These wheels are HARD to find; it looks like I can put Brat
8-spokes on it according to the Subaru parts book for 1989.

Aside from this, and finding the proper wheels, is there another way to
get the proper offset? I was thinking of wheel spacers; I only need 2-5mm
space (I think the difference is 48mm for the 2WD wheel and 50mm for the
AWD wheel). It has that wonky 4x140 bolt pattern.

Is there a safe way to 'shim' the wheels to get a few more mm of offset?

Like john said, using spacers could very well stress the wheel bearing
AND create an unsafe lug nut fitment. maybe other bad stuff too.

There MAY be some Peugeot wheels that will fit???

The guys over at www.ultimatesubaru.org seems to have a lot of
experience keeping older soobs on the road. You might find someone with
advice or even wheels for sale too.

Carl

 

[James]

Like john said, using spacers could very well stress the wheel bearing AND
create an unsafe lug nut fitment. maybe other bad stuff too.

There MAY be some Peugeot wheels that will fit???

Peugeot rims are generally only used to go from 13" to 14" and although 504
rims do fit I don't think the offset is spot on anyway, and you have to find
the special lug nut washers so you can actually secure them properly. Other
Peugeot rims do fit but often more hassle than it's worth. If you were keen
enough to go for 15" for example you have to be sure you do get 15" rims and
not TRX metric rims as was common on Pugs (very limited choice in tyres and
VERY expensive).

Speedline do (or used to) make a 14" rim for them, and there is a company
here in Australia that makes a 14" rim with the correct offset.
http://www.scorpionsubaru.com/

James

 

[Mike Walsh]

Even if the diameter, width, offset, etc. are the same, the shape of the wheel might need to be different to fit over a particular caliper. This was a common problem when american cars changed from drum brakes to disk brakes.

 

[Ray O]

Back to another Subaru I have. The wheels rub against the calipers in the
front. Hey, they fit, they're the right diameter, what gives?!

They're also rusty, so I am trying to replace them. In the course of
looking for used wheels for an '89 Suby GL hacthback (NOT the Brat-looking
hatch, the Loyale looking hatch) I have run across 5 sets of wheels! The
Brat-looking hatch has one that it shares with the Brat looking wagon, the
Loyale has another, the Legacy has another, and the GL hatch has another.

I think what happened was that someone didn't know the difference and put
a set of 2WD offset wheels (Yeah, it appears to make a difference) on an
AWD GL Hatch. These wheels are HARD to find; it looks like I can put Brat
8-spokes on it according to the Subaru parts book for 1989.

Aside from this, and finding the proper wheels, is there another way to
get the proper offset? I was thinking of wheel spacers; I only need 2-5mm
space (I think the difference is 48mm for the 2WD wheel and 50mm for the
AWD wheel). It has that wonky 4x140 bolt pattern.

Is there a safe way to 'shim' the wheels to get a few more mm of offset?

Do not shim the wheels, as all sorts of problems, from balancing, wheel
bearing wear, handling, etc.

You can try looking up different replacement wheels for various Subaru
models at tirerack.com to see which ones have the same fit. They may also
have specs on offset, bolt pattern, etc.

 

[Bruce L. Bergman]

Back to another Subaru I have. The wheels rub against the calipers in the
front. Hey, they fit, they're the right diameter, what gives?!

They're also rusty, so I am trying to replace them. In the course of
looking for used wheels for an '89 Suby GL hacthback (NOT the Brat-looking
hatch, the Loyale looking hatch) I have run across 5 sets of wheels! The
Brat-looking hatch has one that it shares with the Brat looking wagon, the
Loyale has another, the Legacy has another, and the GL hatch has another.

I think what happened was that someone didn't know the difference and put
a set of 2WD offset wheels (Yeah, it appears to make a difference) on an
AWD GL Hatch. These wheels are HARD to find; it looks like I can put Brat
8-spokes on it according to the Subaru parts book for 1989.

Aside from this, and finding the proper wheels, is there another way to
get the proper offset? I was thinking of wheel spacers; I only need 2-5mm
space (I think the difference is 48mm for the 2WD wheel and 50mm for the
AWD wheel). It has that wonky 4x140 bolt pattern.

Is there a safe way to 'shim' the wheels to get a few more mm of offset?

For only 5mm or 1/4" I wouldn't worry about upsetting the wheel
bearings that much with the offset change - that would come into play
if you grossly changed it so the loads were overhung an inch or two.

The thing to worry more about is shearing off wheel studs or not
having enough threads to properly engage the lug nuts, then they strip
the last few threads and come off - you might need to change to longer
studs to make sure there are enough threads.

If you can't find pre-made spacers, I'd have a machine shop (or a
specialty CNC abrasive water-jet cutting shop) cut them out of 1/4"
steel plate. (The plates can be sent out to be "Blanchard Ground"
flat and parallel if you really think it will make a difference, but
you need to go up in thickness to allow for the grinding.)

--<< Bruce >>--

 

[Hachiroku $B%O%A%m%/(B]

If you can't find pre-made spacers, I'd have a machine shop (or a
specialty CNC abrasive water-jet cutting shop) cut them out of 1/4" steel
plate. (The plates can be sent out to be "Blanchard Ground" flat and
parallel if you really think it will make a difference, but you need to go
up in thickness to allow for the grinding.)

But is this going to cost more than $50?

 

[Hachiroku $B%O%A%m%/(B]

Do not shim the wheels, as all sorts of problems, from balancing, wheel
bearing wear, handling, etc.

You can try looking up different replacement wheels for various Subaru
models at tirerack.com to see which ones have the same fit. They may also
have specs on offset, bolt pattern, etc.

These are those weird Suby wheels with the 4x140 bolt pattern. They
stopped this configuration in '90-92 and they're hard to find!

There is a method of 'adapting' a 5x100 hub onto the car, but it's going
to cost 2x what the car cost! (and 3x what it's worth!)

Maybe if it looked like *THIS* I'd do it!

http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2355272750067339125XvxVly

 

[Ray O]

These are those weird Suby wheels with the 4x140 bolt pattern. They
stopped this configuration in '90-92 and they're hard to find!

There is a method of 'adapting' a 5x100 hub onto the car, but it's going
to cost 2x what the car cost! (and 3x what it's worth!)

Maybe if it looked like *THIS* I'd do it!

http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2355272750067339125XvxVly

Yup, that ride appears to be in good condition! All sorts of stuff came up
when I googled "Subaru wheel spacers" but most of it is over $150. Of
course, you can get a pneumatic die grinder to go with your new compressor
and grind the caliper - just kidding!

 

[Tony Hwang]

But is this going to cost more than $50?

Hi,
Zero $ for something like that, LOL! My son-in-law owns s big CNC shop!
Looking at OP id. 86 in Japanese, does it mean his car is 1986 model?
I never owned a car/truck more than 10 years old. Shouldn't car that old
be sent to junk yard? Let the economy roll. Or why not just get a new
set of proper rims anf forget about it. It's kinda safety issue.

 

[Nate Nagel]

Hi,
Zero $ for something like that, LOL! My son-in-law owns s big CNC shop!
Looking at OP id. 86 in Japanese, does it mean his car is 1986 model?
I never owned a car/truck more than 10 years old. Shouldn't car that old
be sent to junk yard?

I'm just gonna assume that that was meant in a joking manner... my car
is an '88, my pickup is a '93, and my second car is a '55! Save the
environment, drive an old car!

nate

 

[Tony Hwang]

I'm just gonna assume that that was meant in a joking manner... my car
is an '88, my pickup is a '93, and my second car is a '55! Save the
environment, drive an old car!

nate

Hmmm,
Old car like those pollute a lot! Newer cars are greener and safer!
We always drive AWD with all the bells and whistles for safety first.
I look after them alway in original condition. I do most work on them.
I no longer have any truck since I sold my 5th wheel camping trailer.
I built a cabin instead. Currently 4 cars in the family. Subaru, Honda,
Suzuki. All farly new.

 

[Hachiroku $B%O%A%m%/(B]

Hi,
Zero $ for something like that, LOL! My son-in-law owns s big CNC shop!
Looking at OP id. 86 in Japanese, does it mean his car is 1986 model? I
never owned a car/truck more than 10 years old. Shouldn't car that old be
sent to junk yard? Let the economy roll. Or why not just get a new set of
proper rims anf forget about it. It's kinda safety issue.

Hachiroku=AE86:

http://www.pbase.com/mr_16v/hachiroku_pics

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=hachi-roku

And my favorite:

http://www.ae86.hu/pics/JIro_Yamada.jpg

1985 Corolla GT-S Twin-Cam, owned since April of 1985, still running but
rusty.

Good catch on the 8-6, though...

 

[Hachiroku $B%O%A%m%/(B]

Hi,
Zero $ for something like that, LOL! My son-in-law owns s big CNC shop!
Looking at OP id. 86 in Japanese, does it mean his car is 1986 model? I
never owned a car/truck more than 10 years old. Shouldn't car that old be
sent to junk yard? Let the economy roll. Or why not just get a new set of
proper rims anf forget about it. It's kinda safety issue.

Oh, BTW, I have the Hachiroku, the '89 Suby GL, an '89 Mazda 626 I paid
$150 that runs GREAT and looks very good, a '97 Suby Legacy L AWD wagon
with a BHG, an '88 Supra in Good-VG condition that spends winters in a
heated garage, and an '05 Scion tC that is spending the winter under a car
cover...

 

[Hachiroku $B%O%A%m%/(B]

Hmmm,
Old car like those pollute a lot!

The '85 Corolla GT-S turns almost the same numbers on the Environmental
tester as it did when it was new. There's a lot to be said for
maintenance. It has 260,000 miles on it...

 

[nobody >]

Yup, that ride appears to be in good condition! All sorts of stuff came up
when I googled "Subaru wheel spacers" but most of it is over $150. Of
course, you can get a pneumatic die grinder to go with your new compressor
and grind the caliper - just kidding!

That's actually an option. My memory might (hell probably is!) be wrong
but IIRC, this wasn't an uncommon thing to do on american hotrods years
ago. The one that comes to mind is converting eary Mustangs to disk
brakes while keeping the factory styled-steel rims. They'd take off
almost a quarter inch.

 

[Bruce L. Bergman]

Hmmm,
Old car like those pollute a lot! Newer cars are greener and safer!
We always drive AWD with all the bells and whistles for safety first.
I look after them alway in original condition. I do most work on them.
I no longer have any truck since I sold my 5th wheel camping trailer.
I built a cabin instead. Currently 4 cars in the family. Subaru, Honda,
Suzuki. All farly new.

No, older cars /in bad mechanical condition/ pollute a lot. If you
keep them in good shape and fix the little things as they break, you
can keep a car or truck on the road practically forever, and your
per-mile costs of driving can go way down.

Some people do not choose to pay a lot more just to drive a new car
every three or four years. They work to live, not live to work.

Buy a new car and you take a huge hit for depreciation, tags and
title, the pension and benefits cost at the manufacturer and dealer, a
portion of the car salesman's new ski boat, etc. etc. etc.

And your monthly costs for insurance are much higher, as any car
with an airbag system costs more to insure - When you run the numbers,
after the car is over about 3 to 4 years old if you get in an accident
that deploys the airbags it's cheaper to total the car than fix it.

Before you spend a dime on the bodywork and paint, just replacing
the airbags and all the sensors and actuators after an accident is
going to run you $3,000 bare minimum. If it has explosive primed
seatbelt tensioners and side curtain airbags and all the toys, that
could easily pass $5,000 when you factor in new seats and the trim
panels that are destroyed during side curtain deployment.

Oh, and you usually break the windshield and/or other window glass
when the airbags blow and the air pressure inside the car spikes,
there's another $600 - $1,500 in glass replacement costs.

Having a new car with airbags will certainly decrease the injuries
from an equivalent accident - but somebody has to pay for the greatly
increased insurance costs, and that somebody is you, the car owner.

--<< Bruce >>--

 

[Tony Hwang]

No, older cars /in bad mechanical condition/ pollute a lot. If you
keep them in good shape and fix the little things as they break, you
can keep a car or truck on the road practically forever, and your
per-mile costs of driving can go way down.

Some people do not choose to pay a lot more just to drive a new car
every three or four years. They work to live, not live to work.

Buy a new car and you take a huge hit for depreciation, tags and
title, the pension and benefits cost at the manufacturer and dealer, a
portion of the car salesman's new ski boat, etc. etc. etc.

And your monthly costs for insurance are much higher, as any car
with an airbag system costs more to insure - When you run the numbers,
after the car is over about 3 to 4 years old if you get in an accident
that deploys the airbags it's cheaper to total the car than fix it.

Before you spend a dime on the bodywork and paint, just replacing
the airbags and all the sensors and actuators after an accident is
going to run you $3,000 bare minimum. If it has explosive primed
seatbelt tensioners and side curtain airbags and all the toys, that
could easily pass $5,000 when you factor in new seats and the trim
panels that are destroyed during side curtain deployment.

Oh, and you usually break the windshield and/or other window glass
when the airbags blow and the air pressure inside the car spikes,
there's another $600 - $1,500 in glass replacement costs.

Having a new car with airbags will certainly decrease the injuries
from an equivalent accident - but somebody has to pay for the greatly
increased insurance costs, and that somebody is you, the car owner.

--<< Bruce >>--

Hmmm,
Knock on the wood. I've been driving over half a century. No accident,
never got stranded on the road, yet. Just a few parking tickets. I
replace my car when there is a sign of oil leak on the garage floor.
That is more or less 10 years driving time. In my working days I drove
company provided car of my choice which I looked after as if it were mine.

 

[Tony Hwang]

Hachiroku=AE86:

http://www.pbase.com/mr_16v/hachiroku_pics

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=hachi-roku

And my favorite:

http://www.ae86.hu/pics/JIro_Yamada.jpg

1985 Corolla GT-S Twin-Cam, owned since April of 1985, still running but
rusty.

Good catch on the 8-6, though...

Hi,
If you ever X-ray a car like that, you'll see sign of metal fatigue,
hair line cracks, hidden rust things like that. Nothing laat forever!