Engines in Forester and Liberty

[Shane White]

Has anoyone noticed that the 2004 Forester and Liberty engines are the
same bore, stroke and compression ratio, yet the power and torque
specs are different -
Forester 223Nm @ 3600rpm, 112kW @ 5600rpm
Liberty 226Nm @ 4400rpm, 121kW @ 5600rpm
The both have identical gearbox ratio's and final drive ratio's out of
interest. Liberty is around half a second quicker to 100kph.

This all seems a little strange. Would the manifolds on the engines be
a little different and the ECU mapping?

Can anyone elaborate?

Shane.

 

[Toby Ponsenby]

Has anoyone noticed that the 2004 Forester and Liberty engines are the
same bore, stroke and compression ratio, yet the power and torque
specs are different -
Forester 223Nm @ 3600rpm, 112kW @ 5600rpm
Liberty 226Nm @ 4400rpm, 121kW @ 5600rpm
The both have identical gearbox ratio's and final drive ratio's out of
interest. Liberty is around half a second quicker to 100kph.

This all seems a little strange. Would the manifolds on the engines be
a little different and the ECU mapping?

Can anyone elaborate?

Shane.

Last I heard, the Forester had a restrictor fitted in association with the
turbo, cf the same mill in the wrx. Some sales bullshit I heard was that it
was to increase torque - presumably at the expense of outright BHP
somewhere along the line.
Probably the same caper again.
BTW, a friend of mine tells me that Subaru sometimes sell two different
ECU's for a given car.
Might be worth checking with people who know the score at Subaru.


--
Toby
quidquid latine dictum
sit, altum viditur
Warning: All posts to be treated with a grain of salt.
By Order
K.K.

 

[MIKE]

The new libertys (Legacy) use now Vtec-type engine (can't remeber what
subaru calls it) and the forester still use the non-Vtec. It too will come
out with then vtec engine ( next release maybe?)
Saying that the power improvements by vtec-ing the boxer has been
disappointing when compared with what Honda achieved.
My guess Subaru focused on emissions & fuel economy to cater to the US &
Japans environmental laws.

Besides if you wanted power you'd get a turbo



-mike

 

[H. Whelply]

Hmmm. I thought my XT had variable exhaust valve timing. Half of VTEC?

HW

 

[Losiho]

Has anoyone noticed that the 2004 Forester and Liberty engines are the
same bore, stroke and compression ratio, yet the power and torque
specs are different -
Forester 223Nm @ 3600rpm, 112kW @ 5600rpm
Liberty 226Nm @ 4400rpm, 121kW @ 5600rpm
The both have identical gearbox ratio's and final drive ratio's out of
interest. Liberty is around half a second quicker to 100kph.

This all seems a little strange. Would the manifolds on the engines be
a little different and the ECU mapping?

Can anyone elaborate?

Shane.

The EJ25 2.5L in the new MY04 Liberty / Outback is 80% new compared to the
old EJ25 in the 3rd Gen Liberty and Forester / Impreza RS. Changes have been
made to the exhaust, intake manifold, and several internal components. That
explains the difference in power. More details are at the Subaru Australia
website :

http://subaru.com.au/news/?newsid=11881

There was also a slight power difference in the old Liberty / Outback 2.5
compared to the 2.5 in the Forester / Impreza RS - 115kw for the Liberty,
112kw for the Impreza / Forester. I believe the 3kw are lost through a
slightly more restrictive exhaust system.

 

[sd]

The new libertys (Legacy) use now Vtec-type engine (can't remeber what
subaru calls it) and the forester still use the non-Vtec. It too will come
out with then vtec engine ( next release maybe?)
Saying that the power improvements by vtec-ing the boxer has been
disappointing when compared with what Honda achieved.
My guess Subaru focused on emissions & fuel economy to cater to the US &
Japans environmental laws.

Just to blow that theory out of the water, all current Honda engines
meet California's stringent LEV or ULEV standards.

The following info is six years old, which just goes to show how far
ahead Honda are when it comes to low emissions:

"The 1998 Honda Accord EX, LX four-cylinder is the first
gasoline-powered car to meet California's stringent
ultra-low-emissions vehicle standard. The ULEV standard requires
reduction of emissions of hydrocarbons, carbon monoxide, and
nitrogen oxides by 50 to 84 percent below federal standards - and the
ULEV Accord's emissions are actually well below even that.

The ULEV engine manages to achieve its low emissions without any
appreciable loss of fuel economy or power (it develops 148hp, versus
150 for the conventional engine). The technology relies on a "lean"
fuel mixture, with less gasoline and more air, during cold starts,
when engines pollute the most. An onboard computer monitors each
engine cylinder's exhaust and continuously adjusts its fuel mixture.
An improved, high-capacity catalytic converter burns up most of the
exhaust pollutants that remain."

 

[Dave_H]

Has anoyone noticed that the 2004 Forester and Liberty engines are the
same bore, stroke and compression ratio, yet the power and torque
specs are different -
Forester 223Nm @ 3600rpm, 112kW @ 5600rpm
Liberty 226Nm @ 4400rpm, 121kW @ 5600rpm
The both have identical gearbox ratio's and final drive ratio's out of
interest. Liberty is around half a second quicker to 100kph.

This all seems a little strange. Would the manifolds on the engines be
a little different and the ECU mapping?

Can anyone elaborate?

Shane.

I saw an article about the Liberty engine, apparently there is a new
inlet and exhaust manifold. From pictures in magazines, I, can tell
the difference between the old and new inlet manifolds straight away.
The new manifolds are set up so the front 2 cylinders (front left,
front right) and the back (bl, br) share manifolds. This is different
from the older engine where each side (fl, bl) and (fr, br) shared
manifolds like a v8 would.

Sound wierd? apparently the boxer engine firing order is such that the
exhaust gasses 'scavenge' better when the various cylinders exhausts
are paired in this fashion.

btw, I havent got under a new liberty to confirm this info. have no
idea how the turbo engines exhausts are configured. Anyone got online
pictures of the new engine?

 

[FFF]

I saw an article about the Liberty engine, apparently there is a new
inlet and exhaust manifold. From pictures in magazines, I, can tell
the difference between the old and new inlet manifolds straight away.
The new manifolds are set up so the front 2 cylinders (front left,
front right) and the back (bl, br) share manifolds. This is different
from the older engine where each side (fl, bl) and (fr, br) shared
manifolds like a v8 would.

Sound wierd? apparently the boxer engine firing order is such that the
exhaust gasses 'scavenge' better when the various cylinders exhausts
are paired in this fashion.

That's weird - it seems logical that a cylinder pair firing at once should NOT
share the exhaust. At first glance that would only elevate sound levels and
increase momentary back pressure. Does anyone have an explanation for this?

curious

florian

 

[randj]

The EJ25 2.5L in the new MY04 Liberty / Outback is 80% new compared to the
old EJ25 in the 3rd Gen Liberty and Forester / Impreza RS. Changes have been
made to the exhaust, intake manifold, and several internal components. That
explains the difference in power. More details are at the Subaru Australia
website :

http://subaru.com.au/news/?newsid=11881

There was also a slight power difference in the old Liberty / Outback 2.5
compared to the 2.5 in the Forester / Impreza RS - 115kw for the Liberty,
112kw for the Impreza / Forester. I believe the 3kw are lost through a
slightly more restrictive exhaust system.

So how does your Liberty go?
I was going to buy a MY04 Forester, but it's too boxy-looking for the
other half , and she's gunning for the Liberty 2.5 wagon. But I've read
conflicting reviews about the 2.5's performance (eg see Wheels COTY edn.
and NRMA 1000 km test).
What gives?
Rob

 

[Losiho]

So how does your Liberty go?

I've got an MY99 Outback, not a Liberty. It works fine for me, especially in
traffic. The 2.5 has a nice spread of torque down low. It's an AWD wagon,
not a sports car

I was going to buy a MY04 Forester, but it's too boxy-looking for the
other half , and she's gunning for the Liberty 2.5 wagon. But I've read
conflicting reviews about the 2.5's performance (eg see Wheels COTY edn.
and NRMA 1000 km test).
What gives?
Rob

Some people love the Forester, but imo the styling (both generations) does
nothing for me. The interior of the current model looks a little "cheap"
(and the seats suck). I haven't read the NRMA test, but Wheels Mag did
achieve 0-100km/h in 9.5 sec for both the Outback Luxury auto and the
Liberty 2.5 Premium auto.

 

[Forg]

The following info is six years old, which
just goes to show how far ahead Honda
are when it comes to low emissions:

"The 1998 Honda Accord EX, LX four-
cylinder is the first gasoline-powered car
to meet California's stringent ultra-low-
emissions vehicle standard.

....

Well, someone had to be first!

Besides, aren't those standards about _percentages_ of
exhaust-gases, to give the car company's biggest cash-cows
(trucks) a way out of meeting real standards? Aren't there
"SUV"s with 7 litre engines that suck down fuel at 10x the
rate of an Accord, but which are still LEV's?


-Forg