Surging Forester

[Skylandia]

I bought an 06 Forester and immediately had a surging problem with it.
It surged and bucked when going down holls and at low speeds while
lookinf got parking places at the market and in traffic. I took it to
the dealer and they said there was "NO PROBLEM" I took it back a
secone time with downloads from a sister site and finally the head
mechanis looked into it. the throttle was "retrained" (say what"?)
and the problem is 75% solved. I haven't had the time to get it back
for further adjustment---but it's doing much better----

So if you have an 06 Forester that is surging---there is a fix (sort
of)

 

[ssslither9]

Hey Skylandia, did you see my final post in 'Hesitation and Surging in
2006 Forester'? I have (had!) about decided to keep mine, since the
only options I have are trading it in for an automatic or for a Legacy
Outback, neither of which do I like/want. What are these "downloads
from a sister site"?

It sounds like my surging isn't as bad as yours, I don't have the issue
when cruising in a parking lot as you describe. (I only have it going
downhill, at a constant speed, between 2500 & 3500, in 2nd and higher
gears.) Still it is clearly exactly what you have.

Someone tell me, how in the world can Subaru expect that people who buy
this car won't complain? How can they call this normal operation?
What's the mindset that makes Subaru think buyers will accept this?

Just to add a postscript...this past weekend I drove the car to a ski
resort, where it was parked for 2 nights / 3 days in a parking garage.
We loaded up the car on the morning of departure and it was fine.
After 3-4 hours of skiing, we arrive back to the car to find the
battery dead!! We've wracked our brains for something we may have
done, but can think of absolutely no way we were responsible. So much
for my idea of "oh well, it surges but at least it's reliable!"

Now I have to go back to the dealer with this car for yet another
problem. sigh.

 

[Carl 1 Lucky Texan]

Hey Skylandia, did you see my final post in 'Hesitation and Surging in
2006 Forester'? I have (had!) about decided to keep mine, since the
only options I have are trading it in for an automatic or for a Legacy
Outback, neither of which do I like/want. What are these "downloads
from a sister site"?

It sounds like my surging isn't as bad as yours, I don't have the issue
when cruising in a parking lot as you describe. (I only have it going
downhill, at a constant speed, between 2500 & 3500, in 2nd and higher
gears.) Still it is clearly exactly what you have.

Someone tell me, how in the world can Subaru expect that people who buy
this car won't complain? How can they call this normal operation?
What's the mindset that makes Subaru think buyers will accept this?

Just to add a postscript...this past weekend I drove the car to a ski
resort, where it was parked for 2 nights / 3 days in a parking garage.
We loaded up the car on the morning of departure and it was fine.
After 3-4 hours of skiing, we arrive back to the car to find the
battery dead!! We've wracked our brains for something we may have
done, but can think of absolutely no way we were responsible. So much
for my idea of "oh well, it surges but at least it's reliable!"

Now I have to go back to the dealer with this car for yet another
problem. sigh.

Just as a wild-@ss-guess . There can be some odd behavior from most
modern cars should you start the car with the accelerator pedla
depressed. This is less of a problem nowadays than in the late 80s/early
90s because so many people are now accsutomed to vehicles with ECUs.
Some of us 'old timers' would start our cars with the gas pedal partly
depressed. The problem nowadays with that, is some ECUs take a 'reading'
from the TPS as a zero point baseline and, starting with the gas pedal
even slightly depressed can 'confuse' the system. I'm proposing there is
a possibility (remote) this could be a problem. Can you confirm that, on
initial starting of the car, the gas pedal is not being depressed?

just a WAG !

Carl

 

[ssslither9]

Hey Carl, can't speak for Skylandia but I'm pretty sure I do *not* do
this when I start the car. That said, I have noticed that sometimes
when I'm changing gears, my gas pedal foot rests lightly enough on the
accelerator to perhaps have some response. I do not think it is at all
correlated with this issue though

As I said in my thread on this subject "hesitation & surging in 06
Forester", I test-drove another 06 Forester and it had the same issue,
albeit somewhat less. I also test-drove an 06 Outback and it had it
too, though much much less noticeable.

 

[Larry Van Wormer]

I bought an 06 Forester and immediately had a surging problem with it.
It surged and bucked when going down holls and at low speeds while
lookinf got parking places at the market and in traffic. I took it to
the dealer and they said there was "NO PROBLEM" I took it back a
secone time with downloads from a sister site and finally the head
mechanis looked into it. the throttle was "retrained" (say what"?)
and the problem is 75% solved. I haven't had the time to get it back
for further adjustment---but it's doing much better----

So if you have an 06 Forester that is surging---there is a fix (sort
of)

This sounded interesting, and might be tied to the "drive by wire"
throttle system, since by "retraining" I would think it's being reset
somehow. Other makes have similar problems, such as Hyundai. The
following was copied from an automotive help site. Other similar
occurances if you google on "drive by wire" surge. Not exactly the same,
but quite similar...

"Anyone know how to deal with this problem: Engine surges when trying to
maintain a constant speed (try to hold 60 mph, it will surge to 62, drop
back to 60, then repeat the surge again every minute or so). Dealer had
no luck locating a solution. 2004 Sante Fe LX 3.5L with auto climate
control, 500 miles, only does it with A/C on, doesn't do it with cruise
control on. Dealer says it might just be the "normal" cycling of the A/C
compressor, but it is very noticeable and annoying, too noticeable in my
opinon to be "normal". Does anyone here think this sounds "normal" (I'm
afraid that I won't be able to get used to it, I've never had a vehicle
act like this simply because of the A/C). Any ideas would be greatly
appreciated.
Thanks,
Rob.
have them to initialize the ETS system and then reset the adaptive
learnt numbers on the APS and TPS...since this 3.5 is drive-by-wire it
is possible that the ETS motor initialization was never performed....you
are very observant in the surge speed....60 to 62....!!!! Also there is
a TSB that tells the Tech to do the Re-learn procedure...tell them to
use the XG350 TSB for that as it applies to this SM also..."

 

[CL (dnoyeB) Gilbert]

This sounded interesting, and might be tied to the "drive by wire"
throttle system, since by "retraining" I would think it's being reset
somehow. Other makes have similar problems, such as Hyundai. The
following was copied from an automotive help site. Other similar
occurances if you google on "drive by wire" surge. Not exactly the same,
but quite similar...

What? 06 Forester has Drive by wire???


--
Thank you,


CL Gilbert
"Then said I, Wisdom [is] better than strength: nevertheless the poor
man's wisdom [is] despised, and his words are not heard." Ecclesiastes 9:16

 

[Blair Baucom]

This sounded interesting, and might be tied to the "drive by wire"
throttle system, since by "retraining" I would think it's being reset
somehow. Other makes have similar problems, such as Hyundai. The
following was copied from an automotive help site. Other similar
occurances if you google on "drive by wire" surge. Not exactly the same,
but quite similar...

What? 06 Forester has Drive by wire???


--
Thank you,


CL Gilbert
"Then said I, Wisdom [is] better than strength: nevertheless the poor
man's wisdom [is] despised, and his words are not heard." Ecclesiastes
9:16

Throttle by wire, same as 2005 Forester.

Blair

 

[CL (dnoyeB) Gilbert]

Skylandia wrote:


I bought an 06 Forester and immediately had a surging problem with it.
It surged and bucked when going down holls and at low speeds while
lookinf got parking places at the market and in traffic. I took it to
the dealer and they said there was "NO PROBLEM" I took it back a
secone time with downloads from a sister site and finally the head
mechanis looked into it. the throttle was "retrained" (say what"?)
and the problem is 75% solved. I haven't had the time to get it back
for further adjustment---but it's doing much better----

So if you have an 06 Forester that is surging---there is a fix (sort
of)


This sounded interesting, and might be tied to the "drive by wire"
throttle system, since by "retraining" I would think it's being reset
somehow. Other makes have similar problems, such as Hyundai. The
following was copied from an automotive help site. Other similar
occurances if you google on "drive by wire" surge. Not exactly the same,
but quite similar...

What? 06 Forester has Drive by wire???


--
Thank you,


CL Gilbert
"Then said I, Wisdom [is] better than strength: nevertheless the poor
man's wisdom [is] despised, and his words are not heard." Ecclesiastes
9:16

Throttle by wire, same as 2005 Forester.

Blair

So the gas pedal is electric? There is no cable running from the pedal
to the throttle underhood?

Just have to ask since that one must have slipped by me!

--
Thank you,


CL Gilbert
"Then said I, Wisdom [is] better than strength: nevertheless the poor
man's wisdom [is] despised, and his words are not heard." Ecclesiastes 9:16

 

[Bill Vollmer]

I will bet your Forester problems are related to the ones I am
experiencing....

With that aside, let me tell you a little more about the
(mechanical/electrical/software?) problems we are having with the vehicle.
The 2006 Forester 2.5X (manual transmission) that we purchased in October
'05 has developed a problem. After starting the vehicle and putting it into
1st gear, the engine RPM climbs from about 1500 RPM to around 3000 RPM
without even pressing on the accelerator. It stays there anywhere from 5 to
30 seconds. If you put the car it first gear, it happily accelerates to
about 20 MPH without your foot on the accelerator. This "usually" happens at
start-up, but once or twice, the RPMs shot up after the car had been driven
for 10 minutes as soon as I had put the clutch in and took my foot off of
the accelerator while slowing down to stop. One of those times, it just
oscillated back and forth between 1500 and 3000 RPM for about 15 seconds.
With this unpredictable increase in engine RPM, I see this as a real "Safety
Issue" so I filed a complaint with the Office of Defects Investigation at
the National Highway Transportation Safety Administration.
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/complain/

The last time I was driving out of the parking garage, my '06 Forester
5-speed did its normal engine-revving thing but then I tried an experiment.
I kept the clutch depressed while I coasted downhill through the garage. I
moved the shifter back and forth between neutral and other gears while
keeping the clutch depressed. Whenever the shifter was put into a position
other than neutral the rpms increased (to 2500-3000) but as soon as I put
the shifter in neutral the rpms dropped back down to around 1200-1500. As
soon as I place the shifter anywhere other that neutral, the rpms went back
up.

Now, the clutch was depressed all this time, so why did the rpms change
based on the position of the shifter? The engine was not being put under
load at any point in time since the clutch was always being pressed.

bivo

 

[Carl 1 Lucky Texan]

Larry Van Wormer wrote:

Skylandia wrote:


I bought an 06 Forester and immediately had a surging problem with it.
It surged and bucked when going down holls and at low speeds while
lookinf got parking places at the market and in traffic. I took it to
the dealer and they said there was "NO PROBLEM" I took it back a
secone time with downloads from a sister site and finally the head
mechanis looked into it. the throttle was "retrained" (say what"?)
and the problem is 75% solved. I haven't had the time to get it back
for further adjustment---but it's doing much better----

So if you have an 06 Forester that is surging---there is a fix (sort
of)


This sounded interesting, and might be tied to the "drive by wire"
throttle system, since by "retraining" I would think it's being
reset somehow. Other makes have similar problems, such as Hyundai.
The following was copied from an automotive help site. Other similar
occurances if you google on "drive by wire" surge. Not exactly the
same, but quite similar...


What? 06 Forester has Drive by wire???


--
Thank you,


CL Gilbert
"Then said I, Wisdom [is] better than strength: nevertheless the poor
man's wisdom [is] despised, and his words are not heard."
Ecclesiastes 9:16

Throttle by wire, same as 2005 Forester.

Blair

So the gas pedal is electric? There is no cable running from the pedal
to the throttle underhood?

Just have to ask since that one must have slipped by me!

Same on my '06 WRX - throttle by wire.

Carl

 

[jbwersal]

I will bet your Forester problems are related to the ones I am
experiencing....

With that aside, let me tell you a little more about the
(mechanical/electrical/software?) problems we are having with the vehicle.
The 2006 Forester 2.5X (manual transmission) that we purchased in October
'05 has developed a problem. After starting the vehicle and putting it into
1st gear, the engine RPM climbs from about 1500 RPM to around 3000 RPM
without even pressing on the accelerator. It stays there anywhere from 5 to
30 seconds. If you put the car it first gear, it happily accelerates to
about 20 MPH without your foot on the accelerator. This "usually" happens at
start-up, but once or twice, the RPMs shot up after the car had been driven
for 10 minutes as soon as I had put the clutch in and took my foot off of
the accelerator while slowing down to stop. One of those times, it just
oscillated back and forth between 1500 and 3000 RPM for about 15 seconds.
With this unpredictable increase in engine RPM, I see this as a real "Safety
Issue" so I filed a complaint with the Office of Defects Investigation at
the National Highway Transportation Safety Administration.
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/complain/

The last time I was driving out of the parking garage, my '06 Forester
5-speed did its normal engine-revving thing but then I tried an experiment.
I kept the clutch depressed while I coasted downhill through the garage. I
moved the shifter back and forth between neutral and other gears while
keeping the clutch depressed. Whenever the shifter was put into a position
other than neutral the rpms increased (to 2500-3000) but as soon as I put
the shifter in neutral the rpms dropped back down to around 1200-1500. As
soon as I place the shifter anywhere other that neutral, the rpms went back
up.

Now, the clutch was depressed all this time, so why did the rpms change
based on the position of the shifter? The engine was not being put under
load at any point in time since the clutch was always being pressed.

bivo

Okay, guys-- I have these exact problems on my manual 2006 Forester!
The slight bucking/surging thing in 3rd gear going downhill or after
letting off the throttle (but also to a lesser degree at low speed in
parking lots)-- but of greater concern, the revving up to nearly 3000
rpm when started cold. This morning it raced backwards out of the
garage, in snow, aiming for my oak tree-- fortunately, this bad
behavior was expected, and I was quick on the brake. I, too, have
noticed that I can stop the revving by putting the car into neutral--
strange. I took it to the dealer last week and they were going to
contact Subaru to see if they are familiar with this problem.... I
suspect that they were being coy-- I can't believe they haven't heard
of this problem with other 2006 sticks!

 

[esciaky33]

1999 Forester RPM jump when cruising downhill

Hi - I recently bought a 1999 Subaru Forester and noticed the same issue twice, under the same conditions. From poking around, I believe this maybe a "surging" issue, but not really sure (and the term is new to me).

Issue: when cruising down a steep hill on the freeway and laying off the accelerator, the RPMs jump (between 3-3.5K) and I hear the engine working/noise increase as if I was starting to hit the accelerator in neutral. This happened twice in the same trip, under the same conditions. Each time, the RPMs lowered to normal levels within 5-10 seconds.

A few (maybe relevant) pieces of context:
- Car was full of people and gear (ie. there were weight considerations)
- AC was running
- The accelerator was not being pushed at all either time
- Have not experienced any other "surging" or RPM, transmission issues in any other driving conditions
- automatic transmission, 168K mileage

Any thoughts or suggestions are much appreciated. Thank you!

 

[Itstonybruh]

I bought an 06 Forester and immediately had a surging problem with it.
It surged and bucked when going down holls and at low speeds while
lookinf got parking places at the market and in traffic. I took it to
the dealer and they said there was "NO PROBLEM" I took it back a
secone time with downloads from a sister site and finally the head
mechanis looked into it. the throttle was "retrained" (say what"?)
and the problem is 75% solved. I haven't had the time to get it back
for further adjustment---but it's doing much better----

So if you have an 06 Forester that is surging---there is a fix (sort
of)

Did you ever figure out a cause for this???

 

[Splitter]

This sounded interesting, and might be tied to the "drive by wire"
throttle system, since by "retraining" I would think it's being reset
somehow. Other makes have similar problems, such as Hyundai. The
following was copied from an automotive help site. Other similar
occurances if you google on "drive by wire" surge. Not exactly the same,
but quite similar...

"Anyone know how to deal with this problem: Engine surges when trying to
maintain a constant speed (try to hold 60 mph, it will surge to 62, drop
back to 60, then repeat the surge again every minute or so). Dealer had
no luck locating a solution. 2004 Sante Fe LX 3.5L with auto climate
control, 500 miles, only does it with A/C on, doesn't do it with cruise
control on. Dealer says it might just be the "normal" cycling of the A/C
compressor, but it is very noticeable and annoying, too noticeable in my
opinon to be "normal". Does anyone here think this sounds "normal" (I'm
afraid that I won't be able to get used to it, I've never had a vehicle
act like this simply because of the A/C). Any ideas would be greatly
appreciated.
Thanks,
Rob.
have them to initialize the ETS system and then reset the adaptive
learnt numbers on the APS and TPS...since this 3.5 is drive-by-wire it
is possible that the ETS motor initialization was never performed....you
are very observant in the surge speed....60 to 62....!!!! Also there is
a TSB that tells the Tech to do the Re-learn procedure...tell them to
use the XG350 TSB for that as it applies to this SM also..."

 

[Splitter]

A comment on another thread bout having the same tires all around commented that their could be a problem with running dissimilar tires. He said that he had a similar problem as you because the tires were different front to back.