*Meltdown* - 2002 Legacy GT

[NyteZero]

Hi.

I blew up my Subaru on Wednesday morning. It was 10 degrees overnight,
so I let the car warm up for about 10 minutes before I left for work on
Wednesday morning. I smelled something burning after I started the
car. I checked the temperature gauge, and all was good. I popped the
hood and, Mag-lite in hand, looked around. There was no smoke and
nothing looked suspicious.

I drove the car about 13 miles and stopped at a gas station to fuel up.
After I pulled onto the fuel island and switched off the engine, thick
white smoke started pouring from the engine compartment. I popped the
hood again to release the heat. The smoke was so thick that I couldn't
see any of the cars driving by on the highway. I thought the car was
on fire. I'm surprised the car even started after that blow up. I let
the engine cool and then attempted to start the engine. It restarted
but the temperature gauge "red lined" immediately. I let it sit
another 15-20 minutes and I eventually got the car off the fuel island.

I checked the reserve tank for coolant / anti-freeze. It was below the
"low" line. I filled it up to the "full" line and restarted the car.
The temperature spiked to about 3/4 and then slowly dropped to
"normal". I got out of the car and checked for leaks -- no leaks. I
let the car idle for 15-20 minutes and watched the temperature. The
needle didn't move. I then decided it was safe to drive, so I pulled
out of the gas station and began to drive to toward the nearest Subaru
dealer (25 miles away). I got about 5 miles down the road and the
temperature gauge nearly red lined again. I had to pull off the
highway into the hazard lane and let her cool down. I then limped to
the next exit and stopped at the gas station.

I had the car towed to the local Subaru dealer. They did an electrical
check on the fan and it is still working. They replaced the thermostat
and the car nearly red lined on them during the test drive. The water
pump is functioning properly as well. My instincts told me that this
was a cracked head gasket and there was probably more problems /w the
severe overheating earlier in the morning.

I traded the car in immediately -- while they were still working on it
-- for a brand new Impreza. I figure it was best to just cut my loses.
As part of the trade-in deal, the dealer is assuming all repair costs
and picked up the towing cost as well.

Has anyone else had a problem like this? Do you think my cracked head
gasket diagnosis is valid?

- G

 

[T]

From your symptoms I would say you had inadequate antifreeze in your
coolant system. Sounds like the water in the motor froze.

I'm not going to get too far into your 'and then I kept driving it'
other than to say the tow truck might have entered into the story a
little earlier.


TBerk

 

[NyteZero]

It was not an anti-freeze issue. I recently found out -- within the
last couple of hours -- that it was actually a well documented issue /w
2002 2.5l engines. I guess it has to do /w a design flaw and air
getting trapped in the cooling system.

 

[John Rethorst]

It was not an anti-freeze issue. I recently found out -- within the
last couple of hours -- that it was actually a well documented issue /w
2002 2.5l engines. I guess it has to do /w a design flaw and air
getting trapped in the cooling system.

Phase 1 or phase 2 engines?

 

[NyteZero]

I'm not sure if it was a phase 1 or 2 failure -- the service tech
didn't specify which one. The car's "in service" date was 01/2002. I
wonder if it was a phase 1 failure. ???.

 

[CompUser]

Has anyone else had a problem like this? Do you think my cracked head
gasket diagnosis is valid?

Absolutely.

 

[TG]

It didn't blow up, YOU blew it up! TG

 

[Edward Hayes]

I agree with T. Even if there was sufficient coolant I suspect that
the concentration was low and the block.head froze enough so that
there was little or no circulation. That would explain why no high
temperature reading initionally. Your insistence on driving did the
damage IMHO. eddie

 

[Mickey]

It was not an anti-freeze issue. I recently found out -- within the
last couple of hours -- that it was actually a well documented issue /w
2002 2.5l engines. I guess it has to do /w a design flaw and air
getting trapped in the cooling system.

Entrapped air in the cooling system is not a 2002 issue, it is typ for
any model that has the radiator mounted very low as in Legacy
models. Doesn't take but a short while to do damage to these engines
if cooling system isn't properly purged of air. It's not a design
issue other than low hood lines not permitting radiator to be mounted
high enough to self purge air when filling.

No big thing if you know the correct procedure. Recently had to pull
the radiator and when refilled according to the manual, only had to
add a small amount of water after first cool cycle and coolant level
has stayed the same for a month and 5k mile trip.

2002 models have phase II engines, sohc design vs dohc design of phase I.

Mickey

 

[NyteZero]

I disagree. Both you and T are fixated on the 10 degree temperature to
the exclusion of other factors. We had sub-freezing temperatures for
the previous week and the car exhibited no symptoms. I live in
Northern Wisconsin -- these temperatures are normal, and we get them
for weeks at a time. We had much colder temperatures a few weeks
earlier and the car had no problems -- this wasn't the first 10 degree
night. I also have an engine block heater which was functioning that
morning.

As I mentioned in my original post, I popped the hood before leaving.
I checked the coolant level before deciding to drive -- the reserve was
at "full" and I had just had a flush performed by the dealership about
10000-12000 miles prior. There is no reason for me to consider a
coolant issue when the coolant was replaced recently and the reserve
was full.

The reason I had to add more coolant after the blow up is because what
was in there boiled over on the fuel island at the gas station.
I explained the entire situation to the service tech at the dealership
and they ruled out a cooling system failure. They identified the point
of failure as the head gasket, and their likely explanation was that it
was as a result of air in the cooling system.

 

[T]

Entrapped air in the cooling system is not a 2002 issue, it is typ for
any model that has the radiator mounted very low as in Legacy models.
Doesn't take but a short while to do damage to these engines if cooling
system isn't properly purged of air. It's not a design issue other than
low hood lines not permitting radiator to be mounted high enough to self
purge air when filling.

No big thing if you know the correct procedure. Recently had to pull
the radiator and when refilled according to the manual, only had to add
a small amount of water after first cool cycle and coolant level has
stayed the same for a month and 5k mile trip.

2002 models have phase II engines, sohc design vs dohc design of phase I.

Mickey

OK. Say, Mickey- what other Subaru motors share the down low radiator
design?

Specifically, would the owner of a 2002 WRX have to worry about this
same issue?

Note to crowd: saw a recent thread (it had 'swirl tank' in it) re:
trapped air in the highest point of the cooling system and a mod to add
a blow off tube to the top that lead to the over flow bottle.


TBerk

 

[T]

I disagree. Both you and T are fixated on the 10 degree temperature to
the exclusion of other factors. We had sub-freezing temperatures for
the previous week and the car exhibited no symptoms. I live in
Northern Wisconsin -- these temperatures are normal, and we get them
for weeks at a time. We had much colder temperatures a few weeks
earlier and the car had no problems -- this wasn't the first 10 degree
night. I also have an engine block heater which was functioning that
morning.

As I mentioned in my original post, I popped the hood before leaving.
I checked the coolant level before deciding to drive -- the reserve was
at "full" and I had just had a flush performed by the dealership about
10000-12000 miles prior. There is no reason for me to consider a
coolant issue when the coolant was replaced recently and the reserve
was full.

The reason I had to add more coolant after the blow up is because what
was in there boiled over on the fuel island at the gas station.
I explained the entire situation to the service tech at the dealership
and they ruled out a cooling system failure. They identified the point
of failure as the head gasket, and their likely explanation was that it
was as a result of air in the cooling system.

No, I'm not fixated. Try and keep up. Right now, we, the collective we
including you & me and the others seem to have 'air trapped in coolant
system' as the plausible theory.

I will say however your symptoms as originally mentioned fit having part
of the coolant system blocked with an ice plug.


TBerk

 

[jabario]

The dealer should have added proper concentration of water/AF if the
service was only 10k ago.

 

[NyteZero]

T -- I agree that an ice plug is a plausible explanation based on the
initial information. I didn't include all of the details in the
initial post because I wasn't expecting the thread to get in-depth.
I'm just trying to understand why and how this happened so I can better
identify it next time.

I think there was a head gasket problem a few days before the failure,
but I'm not a mechanic, so I wasn't smart enough to recognize the
symptoms. I think it got progressively worse until it finally "blew"
on Wednesday. After the recent problem, and as I read more about head
gasket failures, I recognized a couple of things...

1) One morning a few days prior to the blow up, I remember thinking
that my heater wasn't blowing as hot as normal. The heater used to
blow hot enough to defrost the driver and passenger side windows. All
of a sudden it wasn't able to do it. I checked coolant / anti-freeze
levels and they were a bit low (maybe a quart). I refilled to proper
level, and the problem went away.

2) During that same period of time, I occasionally smelled something
burning when warming up the car. I now know that it was probably
anti-freeze burning as a result of a leaky head gasket. I was smart
enough to check my fluid levels at this point, and I didn't see a
noticeable change in either the reserve or the radiator itself. Of
course, I also just refilled it a day earlier after I noticed the
heater not working as well as usual. I didn't give it much further
thought, but made a mental note to mention it to my service tech during
my next oil change.

I could have done a better job of identifying these signs earlier if I
was properly educated on the issue -- I know that. The car only had
68,000 miles on it, and I trusted Subaru's reputation of quality, so I
didn't take the early symptoms seriously.

I do, however, think it is clear that the head gasket failed first and
then the overheating started.

 

[TG]

Your the one that said you blew it up and that you drove it 13 miles after
you smelled something burning. TG

 

[TG]

When I refill my system I jack the front end up as high as I can and that
seems to help.

 

[Mickey]

Mickey wrote:


OK. Say, Mickey- what other Subaru motors share the down low radiator
design?

Specifically, would the owner of a 2002 WRX have to worry about this
same issue?

Note to crowd: saw a recent thread (it had 'swirl tank' in it) re:
trapped air in the highest point of the cooling system and a mod to add
a blow off tube to the top that lead to the over flow bottle.


TBerk

I'm not that familiar with all the models but if the crankshaft is abt
mid point point on the radiator I'd be concerned when servicing the
radiator.

In another post someone said they jack up the front of the car. IMO a
bad idea. The water exits the engine mid way. With the engine at an
angle, air trapped at the front of the engine has no way to escape.

Mickey

 

[webguy]

The models that are known to have problems with their headgaskets are:

*2000 - 2002 Subaru Legacy and Outback with 2.5L engines
*1999 - 2002 Subaru Impreza with 2.5L engines
*1999 - 2002 Forester with 2.5L engines

You can get more information or help here:
http://www.subaruproblems.com

 

[KLS]

The models that are known to have problems with their headgaskets are:

*2000 - 2002 Subaru Legacy and Outback with 2.5L engines
*1999 - 2002 Subaru Impreza with 2.5L engines
*1999 - 2002 Forester with 2.5L engines

You can get more information or help here:
http://www.subaruproblems.com

Thanks for posting this website: it's very helpful.