How to avoid rust...

[Dominic Richens]

I recently bought a 95 Legacy Wagon up here in salt-happy Ottawa and would
like to hear people's experience with rust; where does it show up first, how
to stop it, how to prevent it.

The car looks mint right now, the previous owner had it Zibarted and did the
annual rust checks, every ding, nick and dent has been carefully touched up,
and kept it in the garage (I don't have a garage).

Now that I own a Soobie, I've notice there are a lot of older Legacies and
Loyales that seem pretty rust free.

The only odd place I've noticed rust is on the bottom front of the driver's
door. When it rains water leaks into the door seal (don't know where) and
pools on the door frame (plastic lip). The rubber seal on the two doors
looks identical, but one leaks and the other doesn't.

Any tips?

 

[Frank Logullo]

I recently bought a 95 Legacy Wagon up here in salt-happy Ottawa and would
like to hear people's experience with rust; where does it show up first, how
to stop it, how to prevent it.

The car looks mint right now, the previous owner had it Zibarted and did the
annual rust checks, every ding, nick and dent has been carefully touched up,
and kept it in the garage (I don't have a garage).

Now that I own a Soobie, I've notice there are a lot of older Legacies and
Loyales that seem pretty rust free.

The only odd place I've noticed rust is on the bottom front of the driver's
door. When it rains water leaks into the door seal (don't know where) and
pools on the door frame (plastic lip). The rubber seal on the two doors
looks identical, but one leaks and the other doesn't.

Any tips?

I do not know exactally what Subaru does but most cars are built today from
galvanized steel. Some is 2 side galvanized but I think most is only one
side because it is tough to weld. (Renault actually dips the whole car in a
vat of zink after welding together). After frame is constructed, body is
cleaned and dipped in a phosphatizing bath followed by a baked on epoxy/zinc
coat before painting. Worse thing that happens is bubble formation when
body is in bath and part does not get coated inside. This can result in an
area that rusts from the inside out where steel is not galvanized or coated.
Zibarting is not recommended on modern cars and can actually be a corrosion
source since they drill holes in the body to do the treatement. Maybe if
you can access that door area and dry out and spray with something like
Rustoleum, you can stop problem but if rust is bad from inside out, you may
have to repair or replace.
Frank

 

[Dominic Richens]

Frank Logullo wrote:

[...bunch of good info snipped...]

Maybe if you can access that door area and dry out and
spray with something like Rustoleum, you can stop problem but if rust
is bad from inside out, you may have to repair or replace.

Thanks for reply. I'm pretty sure that water is pooling along the bottom of
the ledge and there just happened to be a chip in the paint at the point in
the door where the rust is.

I'll just lightly sand the rust off and touch it up with Tremclad. As long
as nothing else rusts around there I won't worry about the water leak.

 

[null]

If the water is pooling at the bottom then its probably rusting from the
inside out. Basically the vehicle will
rust wherever it can find unprotected metal. This happens mostly where
water and dirt can get in. Then when it gets
wet it usually stays wet and this causes the rust. Salt just speeds up the
process. In the Subarus I've seen the most
often seen rust areas are.

Along bottom of rear hatch
Bottom of fenders behind the wheel (most often as snow,mud,water is just
continously thrown into this area)
Bottom of doors
Rocker panels
Around Gas door
Anywhere dirt and water can accumulate.
If you get rust from the inside out sanding the outside surface and
painting will last probably 6months as the inside
is going to continue to rust and bubble out.
For the doors your best bet is to take the inside of the door off and
completely clean it out. Make sure you get the
drain holes cleared. This is probably the root cause of the problem. Enough
dirt got in to clog the drain holes in the
bottom of the door and the dirt and water has just been sitting in there.
Once you've got it all clear, get it dry. Compressed air and a hair dryer
should help. You need to get into all the
little knooks and crannies. Then you could try a rust-stop agent like those
from Eastwood Co.
(http://www.eastwoodco.com/department.asp?dep_key1=RusPre&SKW=FRUST).
Without cutting out all the damaged area and replacing it you're not going
to get rid of the rust but with these products you can stop it from getting
worse. I've talked to people that have used these products and have been
happy with the results. Other then that you need to keep any vulnerable
areas clean. A friend of mine has a Ford Tarus, SVT. This vehicle has side
body moulding along the bottom. He thought he kept his car emaculantly
clean until we removed the moulding and I showed him all the sand and dirt
packed into the moulding. It was still wet even though it hadn't rained for
weeks. The car is only a few years
old and the dirt was already wearing down the paint and if we hadn't
cleaned it out within a couple years it would have surely started to rust.

Frank Logullo wrote:

[...bunch of good info snipped...]

Maybe if you can access that door area and dry out and
spray with something like Rustoleum, you can stop problem but if rust
is bad from inside out, you may have to repair or replace.

Thanks for reply. I'm pretty sure that water is pooling along the bottom
of
the ledge and there just happened to be a chip in the paint at the point
in
the door where the rust is.

I'll just lightly sand the rust off and touch it up with Tremclad. As
long
as nothing else rusts around there I won't worry about the water leak.

 

[Dominic Richens]

If the water is pooling at the bottom then its probably rusting from
the inside out.

I don't expect this is so, however the Haynes manual shows how to take the
door apart so I'll do this and make sure it's clean and the drain holes are
clear.

cheers!

 

[Lance B]

I do not know exactally what Subaru does but most cars are built today from
galvanized steel. Some is 2 side galvanized but I think most is only one
side because it is tough to weld. (Renault actually dips the whole car in a
vat of zink after welding together). After frame is constructed, body is
cleaned and dipped in a phosphatizing bath followed by a baked on epoxy/zinc
coat before painting. Worse thing that happens is bubble formation when
body is in bath and part does not get coated inside. This can result in an
area that rusts from the inside out where steel is not galvanized or coated.
Zibarting is not recommended on modern cars and can actually be a corrosion
source since they drill holes in the body to do the treatement. Maybe if
you can access that door area and dry out and spray with something like
Rustoleum, you can stop problem but if rust is bad from inside out, you may
have to repair or replace.
Frank

All cars these days are manufactured with the rust proofing method
outlined by Frank or in some way similar. I also agree with Frank
regarding the rust proofers. It is not recommended to rust proof. Just
make sure all the drain holes are clear and clean and if so every few
years pull off the trim panels and access the door insides to clean
the bottom of the doors where the drain holes are. That is if you are
keen to do it. Dirt/dust build up is the biggest enemy as it traps the
salts etc and when it gets wet from the rain it stays damp and thus
causes the corrosion. A good clean out of these areas periodically
will keep them rust free.

 

[Frank Logullo]

All cars these days are manufactured with the rust proofing method
outlined by Frank or in some way similar. I also agree with Frank
regarding the rust proofers. It is not recommended to rust proof. Just
make sure all the drain holes are clear and clean and if so every few
years pull off the trim panels and access the door insides to clean
the bottom of the doors where the drain holes are. That is if you are
keen to do it. Dirt/dust build up is the biggest enemy as it traps the
salts etc and when it gets wet from the rain it stays damp and thus
causes the corrosion. A good clean out of these areas periodically
will keep them rust free.

Actually, my observations come from work I did over 10 years ago on
plastic body panels. The "paint shop" in an assembly plant where all
the finishing is done accounts for about 1/3 of the cost of an
assembly plant. All this was in effect them and I assume things are
even better. My 10 year old Nissan has zero rust.
All I do is try to wash it frequently when roads are salted.
Frank

 

[Robert Semrad]

Rust NEVER Sleeps..........

 

[Dominic Richens]

I once had a car Ziebarted, but never again.

Their spray clogged up many of the normal drain holes, and they
scratched through the paint in several areas when they stuck in the
nozzle.

Check the drain holes on the bottom of each door and under the rocker
panels and clear any plugged holes.

When I brought the car into the Subaru dealership for a pre-sale inspection,
the mechanic said he personally didn't recommend Ziebart, but this car was
particularly well done and all the drain holes he knew of were clear, so
there was no harm done.

I nodded knowingly and said "Ah!", but until now didn't really have a clue
about what he was saying

 

[Felix Crashalot]

I have a Legacy wagon 95, and I live in Montreal. Here's where mine
has started to rust:
- Bottom of the front doors, inside where you see the "seam", where
the outside sheet is folded over the inside sheet and there's a line
sealant glued on. It starts at the rear end of the door. You can
open the inside, clean it to remove dirt (that keeps the area moist)
and maybe shoot some oil there, but few can be done, as this area is
hard to reach.
- Under the plastic moulding that covers the sheet metal, between the
rear door and the wheel well. Not much to do there too. Removing the
moulding to check can do more damage, as the snaps will remove the
paint.
- The antenna mount.
- The handle of the rear hatch requires oil regularly, the metal base
of the handle is rusted. But the hatch itself is perfect.

For an 8-yr old car in my area, this is very good! This generation of
Legacy is far better than the previous one for rust protection.

For the door/window seal, you can add a closed-cell foam strip in the
open space (that space where you can slide your finger in) of the
seal, to add more pressure of the inner lip to the window and door
sheets.

 

[Ed Fortmiller]

Put LPS-3 in every crack, crevis, hole, and place you can find and it will
slow the rust down. Better to do it before the rust starts though. Get it
in the bottom of the doors (might have to pull a panel), coat the bottom
inner edge of the doors, inside the fenders, etc. I even put it on the lower
part of the paint all the way around the car. Turns blackish (from getting
dirty) after awhile but I'd rather have blackish LPS-3 than brown rust.
Clean it off in the spring.

http://www.lpslabs.com/Products/CorrosionInh/Lps3.asp

--
Ed Fortmiller | (e-mail address removed) | Hudson MA
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