defacto traction control?

[Yousuf Khan]

I have a 2000 OBW with the 5 MT, which has the completely
visco-mechanical AWD system (i.e. not computer controlled). Yesterday
there was freezing rain here in town and I was moving my cars around on
the driveway. There was a smooth layer of glare ice on the driveway,
going up in a slight incline (I'd estimate maybe a 1%-3% incline). All
four wheels were on ice, so no real traction anywhere. As I was crawling
up that driveway, I assume all four wheels were slipping to some extent.
Then I saw the ABS light come on, even though I hadn't pressed the
brakes. So it looks like the ABS comes on when all four wheels are
slipping? I'm sure the ABS did actually come on because I could smell
some burning rubber afterwards. So is this plausible? I don't have the
VDC or any traction control options on this car other than the AWD itself.

Yousuf Khan

 

[Jim Stewart]

I have a 2000 OBW with the 5 MT, which has the completely
visco-mechanical AWD system (i.e. not computer controlled). Yesterday
there was freezing rain here in town and I was moving my cars around on
the driveway. There was a smooth layer of glare ice on the driveway,
going up in a slight incline (I'd estimate maybe a 1%-3% incline). All
four wheels were on ice, so no real traction anywhere. As I was crawling
up that driveway, I assume all four wheels were slipping to some extent.
Then I saw the ABS light come on, even though I hadn't pressed the
brakes. So it looks like the ABS comes on when all four wheels are
slipping? I'm sure the ABS did actually come on because I could smell
some burning rubber afterwards. So is this plausible? I don't have the
VDC or any traction control options on this car other than the AWD itself.

The ABS light indicates a fault, not activation.

Presumably, the ABS computer somehow got confused
with wheels slipping at different rates.

 

[mulder]

I have a 2000 OBW with the 5 MT, which has the completely
visco-mechanical AWD system (i.e. not computer controlled). Yesterday
there was freezing rain here in town and I was moving my cars around on
the driveway. There was a smooth layer of glare ice on the driveway,
going up in a slight incline (I'd estimate maybe a 1%-3% incline). All
four wheels were on ice, so no real traction anywhere. As I was crawling
up that driveway, I assume all four wheels were slipping to some extent.
Then I saw the ABS light come on, even though I hadn't pressed the
brakes. So it looks like the ABS comes on when all four wheels are
slipping? I'm sure the ABS did actually come on because I could smell
some burning rubber afterwards. So is this plausible? I don't have the
VDC or any traction control options on this car other than the AWD itself.

Yousuf Khan

The burning rubber was probably just the tires slipping on the ice.
The ABS light presumably came on because the wheel sensor readings did
not coincide with the vehicle speed sensor.

 

[Carl 1 Lucky Texan]

I have a 2000 OBW with the 5 MT, which has the completely
visco-mechanical AWD system (i.e. not computer controlled). Yesterday
there was freezing rain here in town and I was moving my cars around on
the driveway. There was a smooth layer of glare ice on the driveway,
going up in a slight incline (I'd estimate maybe a 1%-3% incline). All
four wheels were on ice, so no real traction anywhere. As I was crawling
up that driveway, I assume all four wheels were slipping to some extent.
Then I saw the ABS light come on, even though I hadn't pressed the
brakes. So it looks like the ABS comes on when all four wheels are
slipping? I'm sure the ABS did actually come on because I could smell
some burning rubber afterwards. So is this plausible? I don't have the
VDC or any traction control options on this car other than the AWD itself.

Yousuf Khan


----------------------------------------------------------

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color]
How very unexpected. I assume you're certain the handbrake was
completely disengaged? That's the only think I can think of. I wouldn't
expect a burning rubber smell from tires on an actual layer of ice.
You'd see steam(vapor) before the surface got hot enough to scorch
rubber. I dunno

Carl
1 Lucky Texan

 

[Yousuf Khan]

The burning rubber was probably just the tires slipping on the ice.
The ABS light presumably came on because the wheel sensor readings did
not coincide with the vehicle speed sensor.

That sensors things seems to make some sense to me. However, could the
tire rubber burning be possible when it's slipping on a nearly
frictionless surface?

Yousuf Khan

 

[Yousuf Khan]

How very unexpected. I assume you're certain the handbrake was
completely disengaged? That's the only think I can think of. I wouldn't
expect a burning rubber smell from tires on an actual layer of ice.
You'd see steam(vapor) before the surface got hot enough to scorch
rubber. I dunno

I didn't pay nearly enough attention, but I do believe that I did see
steam coming out the back, through my mirror.

But I've seen that sort of steam before, it usually involves puddle
water hitting one of my very hot brake rotors and steaming off. I
believe sometimes it even happens when it hits the exhaust system, as my
car's undercar heat shield is gone.

Yousuf Khan

 

[wiz561]

I had a saturn with traction control years ago. It snowed a lot (about
6 inches) and while pulling out of the driveway, my saturn got stuck.
I thought to myself "hey, i'll just hit the gas to get out"...well,
that didn't work. With my tire(s) spinning, I smelt burning rubber as
well.

You would think that the rubber wouldn't burn because it's on a
slippery surface...but I wonder if it does it because of the friction
or something... I'm not a physics expert...but I can at least say the
same smell happened to me on snow/ice!

 

[Michael Pardee]

I had a saturn with traction control years ago. It snowed a lot (about
6 inches) and while pulling out of the driveway, my saturn got stuck.
I thought to myself "hey, i'll just hit the gas to get out"...well,
that didn't work. With my tire(s) spinning, I smelt burning rubber as
well.

You would think that the rubber wouldn't burn because it's on a
slippery surface...but I wonder if it does it because of the friction
or something... I'm not a physics expert...but I can at least say the
same smell happened to me on snow/ice!

My SWAG is that the tires melt through the ice until they start touching the
hard surface underneath. That little contact patch might smoke while the
actual weight is still mostly on the ice.

Mike

 

[JD]

My SWAG is that the tires melt through the ice until they start touching
the hard surface underneath. That little contact patch might smoke while
the actual weight is still mostly on the ice.

Mike

Tires will most definitely heat up on ice if you spin them fast enough
because the heat generated by the friction exceeds the ability of the ice
and snow to cool the tire. Up here, it is fairly common to have them build
up enough heat to blow when spinning on ice and snow. Many people run lower
pressures in the winter to get better traction, but the cost is that heat
will build up faster if the tire is slipping.

 

[DANIEL HUBER]

I've spun tires on ice a number of times, and in snow, and began smoking
them on my Acclaim that I used to have. Certainly possible due to friction.