buying my first subaru

Discussion in 'General Motoring' started by phadras, Feb 8, 2005.

  1. phadras

    phadras Guest


    i've settled on the forester 2.5 xt as my first subaru. i've found a
    dealer in town that selling a 2005 w/ 1700 miles on it. they're asking
    about $800 below invoice (as i've priced it on, presumably due
    to the high milage.

    my concern is that this car has probably had a relatively hard 1700
    miles on it, as this particular model appeals to sports driving

    how concerned would you all be with this deal? i've heard that you
    can't kill a subaru and as far as i know, the car would be covered
    under subaru's factory warrantee. since they're already asking for less
    than invoice, what's a reasonable starting point for my asking price?

    phadras, Feb 8, 2005
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  2. phadras

    Alan Guest

    1700 hard miles, I'm sure. I know how I drove it when I tested one. I always
    test drive one I don't want (wrong color or trim).
    Alan, Feb 8, 2005
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  3. phadras

    Todd H. Guest

    My gut and experience says you can do better.

    Dealer invoice is not dealer cost. Don't forget to factor in that the
    factory pays them 3% holdback on the invoice cost--so actual dealer
    cost on the vehicle is 97% of the invoice, minus any factory to dealer
    incentives (if any).

    Your concern is a valid one...and 1700 on a "new" car is a hell of a
    lot. I think you're in a position to remain unemotional and either
    turn the screw on them further on that deal (which isn't that great,
    honestly), or get them to match that price on a truly new one.

    Factoring in hold-back for actual dealer cost, I managed to get a
    local dealer down to making I think $250 on my car. The salesman was
    near the end of his month and very close to a nice incentive vacation
    package for a weekend getaway and was _very_ motivated.

    Another must-read:

    I also found consumer reports new car pricing service very useful
    because it listed all options and packages out individually, so i
    could tally up invoice cost with just that print out in hand for any
    given unit on a dealer's lot. has the same pricing info
    though you'll need to be in front of a computer to price out a given
    option package.

    Best Regards,
    Todd H., Feb 8, 2005
  4. phadras

    newman Guest

    outstanding information. you're right: this seems like less and less of
    a great deal the more i learn. my dogma was (and still is) never buy on
    test drive day, no matter how much you like the car and/or deal. now it
    seems as though i'll have to wait on my fightingchance or consumer
    reports packet.

    thanks again.

    newman, Feb 8, 2005
  5. Those 1700 miles are probably "Dealer Employee" miles.

    Ever notice those special "dealer" plates? Also ever notice how
    aggressively asinine they drive? Would you want them doing that in YOUR
    car? After all to them, its disposable...

    Offer em a buck off invoice per mile at least, but hit em with that after
    you do stuff like look at tire wear, etc. that might give you hints as to
    what was done with the car.
    Sparky Polastri, Feb 9, 2005
  6. phadras

    Todd H. Guest

    Actually, I bought mine oneline on their website and printed it right

    Dont' forget that buying a new car can be a lot of fun... because in
    no other situation are you dealing with a commodity item you can get
    from multiple places for which you can have such perfect information
    on exactly what the dealer paid.

    I enjoyed the hell out of it, frankly. :)

    Be sure to say no to all the high-profit-margin extras (rustproofing,
    extended warranties, financing if you don't qualify for the best
    rate--though I used their 2.9% financing to good avail, etc) they'll
    try to stick you with after you agree on price, and set a timer and
    tell them "I'm setting my watch for 45 minutes. If I'm not out of
    here in that amount of time, this deal is off.

    Lots of great tips like this on that web site I linked ya to.

    Have fun!

    Best Regards,
    Todd H., Feb 9, 2005
  7. phadras

    newman Guest

    yes, i just ordered the packet from fightingchance.

    i test drove the car this am (now up to 2500 miles!!). we got about an
    inch last night and i insisted we take it on the uplowed roads behind
    the dealership. what a champ this thing is in the slush! and it really
    hummed on the highway... there were no visible defects or signs of wear
    and tear. it handled and drove beautifully.

    long and short, that's the model for me. as for the particular car,
    they're actually offering it as used.

    anyone care to help me formulate an offer? here's my thinking:

    since the car is being offered as used, i will assume that it has had a
    previous owner (i stupidly did not get the whole story from the
    salesman). therefore, there should be a fixed amount of depreciation
    that occured based soley on that fact (i.e. a care looses X% of its
    value as soon as you drive it off the lot). I will deduct that from the
    invoice price. furthermore, i am certain that this car has been driven
    hard to this point (although for being manufactured in 4/04, the milage
    is probably just on the low side) so I will deduct more for that.

    thoughts? proposals? oh yeah, i'm paying cash but they don't know about
    that yet (or my terminally ill 93 explorer trade-in).

    sorry for the long post, but you guys are awesome. i can't wait to get
    my own soob!

    newman, Feb 9, 2005
  8. phadras

    Dave Guest

    I did something similar for an '03 XS. It was a 'take-back' that
    someones financing fell through on. I made them throw in a 100k
    warranty with a $50 deductible.
    Dave, Feb 10, 2005
  9. phadras

    newman Guest

    invoice is $24, 258 (turbo boost guage and short throw shifter
    installed). assuming this is a dealer buy-back (my salesman has the day
    off today, so i couldn't get the full story) i think i've come up with
    a negotiation strategy i'm comfortable with. of course, i can walk away
    at any time which gives me an advantage. i'd like to let this guy deal
    because i believe they'd like to get it off the lot (at a lot of
    dealers it doesn't go to internet sales unless it's been on the lot for
    i think i'll wait until a little closer until the end of the month
    (although i'm secretly chomping at the bit. it's a little like waiting
    to call a girl you're interested in. i've gotten a lot better at
    "playing it cool")

    newman, Feb 10, 2005
  10. phadras

    Todd H. Guest

    Invoice price less the 3% holdback you mean. :) AFter all, that
    first owner paid for that I'm certain.
    Dont' expect to get more than $500 for the trade in if you negotiate a
    solid price. You'd do better selling it privately.
    It's a rush!

    What's the invoice on this thing? I'm thinking the miles and used
    ness and all that jazz is worth at least couple grand below invoice.
    Or get them to throw in a 100k no deductible extended warranty at no
    additional cost to offset your "hard driven miles" concern.

    The key to this negotiating is having it crystal clear to yourself
    that you kinda would rather not have this vehicle unless they make it
    worth your while on price. You'd rather have an actually new one.

    Be prepared to walk away, and hell start out at 4k below invoice.
    Wort they can say is no. Time final negotiations for a rainy or
    gloomy icky day near the end of the month. :)

    If you can find out how much they rape the previous owner out of on
    return of it, that might give additional leverage. Note that on this
    unit, you don't have perfect knowledge of what the dealer has or has
    not already made on the car. Which makes it something you can be more
    aggressive on to ferret out. :)
    Todd H., Feb 10, 2005
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